And the debate rages on! Well the dyno graphs are very fishy indeed for a 3.8L engine. Especially a turbocharged one since the first one shows almost 300lb/ft of torque before 2k rpm on a turbo that doesn't spool till ~4k rpm. The third one for sure is a Neon SRT-4 graph since that'* what they look like and are very unique to the 2.4L turbo engine in those cars, the horsepower and torque follow each other closely up the graph.

I have had dyno sheets, videos, timeslips and pictures of the car. I have also actually been on the phone with Turtle when he started the car, got in, put the windows down, and drove around town for a half hour with him flooring it, hearing the turbo spool, lots of angry sounds from the engine and when he let off the throttle the wonderful blow off sound Psssshhh....

So for now have to take it at face value until Turtle shows up here. Hopefully this can be straightened out soon.

I, too, have witnessed all the same things, and actually have audio of a phone conversation with Turtle a couple weeks ago when we each fired our own cars up for some noise sharing.

He does indeed have a fast car, and it does indeed have a turbo, but these are not his Dyno sheets. I'm trying to contact Turtle right now to clear this up.

Thats cool, but I have to be devils advocate here.

Its Turtles time to talk now, adding fuel to the fire isnt going to help. I am as skeptical as ever since I have not been witness to this vehicle.

I hate being skeptical, and its time to get some real meat on the bone.

I've been quiet watching this unfold on both sites today. Every point is valid, and i've said this is going to happen for certain reasons.

Right now I'm a doubter, and i'm not just talking about a damn car anymore.

I've been watching too. CGP has some good points, but they are being VERY VERY immature about it. I'm just gonna wait for Turtle to show up. I'm done in this thread.

This would be called embellishment. There are a few of you that can verify that his car makes impressive sounds, has a turbo and seems fast. From all I've read, that'* the only verification there is of anything.

What you have here is an exaggerated claim of HP utilizing stolen dyno sheets. Hopefully the next time I follow a link here from ClubGP, it will be for something that is as legitimate as it is impressive.

It'* fine to accept timeslips and dyno sheets at face value in most cases, but when it comes to a claim like this, you really need to have supporting video to go along with the dyno or track run. After all, we are talking about breaking a major record here. Hopefully you will all get to the bottom of it. I'm sure you don't like being taken in anymore than the rest of the audience to your forum.

So who'* the next fastest most powerful Bonnie? I guess they can retain their title in light of this.

I'm with sol, i'm done till i see real proof.

Suggestion, someone from Club GP goes with him to the Dyno next time he goes by, should be sometime soon with the fuel pump problems. No more staff, no more people who've been around this problem. Someone from the other site, who knows their stuff enough to report back to everyone. He'* from BC Canada.

As I've said on the GP site, The Bonneville site is more laid back and not as concerned with massive HP and quarter mile times. Very different flavors indeed. But if the man is posting bogus stuff then we indeed have a problem. This needs to be handled asap. This is not good for any of us in the 3800 community.

For the sake of interest and co-operation, a GP member in British Columbia should witness a dyno, and one of our Resident Gearheads PontiacDad another British Columbia resident should be present to witness this event and dispell any rumour beyond the shadow of a doubt.

That would be a grand day if that was to happen. Or we can say to hell with this and not consider the information as valid. I dont mean to divide GP and Bonneville, this is for the greater good of the 3800 community.

Coming from a V8 guy

I've been following the CGP story today too. As usual, a couple of them enjoy slamming me personally. I don't take issue with it at all. I do what the owner of this site expects, and what the members do. What a couple former troublemakers think is of no concern. (These are CGP members that have been banned in the past by either Hector, Don, or Myself for flaming here). I, as well as the members here, appreciate the cooler heads over at CGP. A mutual understanding between our Site owner and the CGP Administration should keep things on an even keel between these two boards, as long as everyone remembers our strict no-flames policy. So far, this thread is fine. Somebody posted some very legitimate questions, and I think we all deserve some very legitimate answers.

I appreciate the investigation into the Dyno sheets that CGP did. Part of my reason for convincing Turtle to publicize his 'proof' was because I was tired of advocating it, without his blessing to show it all. Hector was in much the same boat for some time.

If Turtle has some plausible explanation for the Dyno sheets he emailed me, we'll know more. Obviously there isn't a chance in hell that they're his, but maybe he has some reason for submitting them to the public? Frustration? Messing with people'* heads? Won't know until he steps in here.

If he DOESN'T have some sort of plausible explanation, I serously doubt we'll hear from him again. I know he has a fast car, but I'd really like to see HIS Dyno sheets this time.