GM halts all Future RWD Models due to new Cafe Standards - Page 4 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


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Old 04-11-2007, 01:48 PM   #31
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One other problem with that idea SOL. that will drop the sales of Cars all together, If people dont need one they wont have one.

Then we will be back to the 1920'* and stuff. then Prices will drop for cars and gas.. then people will wont cars again because they are cheap again.. then the price will be right back up...
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:50 PM   #32
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I think that a drastic change like that won't happen. People will still need cars. However, if I can cut back 50 miles of driving a week to save some gas, I'm all for it. If everyone can do that, think of the impact that will make on our dependency.
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:58 PM   #33
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50 miles ROFL i do that a day.
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:58 PM   #34
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Of course that would work Sol. (seriously, not sarcastic)

And people won't quit buying cars, Many people keep a highway car for long trips now. In this future thay'd keep a car for trips outside the city, Just like many people in NYC do now.


The problem you'll find is getting people to want it. It'* like trying to teach a redneck that FI is better than carb. It'* been 30 years and we still haven't done it. If there is something easier, The masses will jump in head first. They'll probably have to be swayed by their wallets, Which means either operating the transit system at a deficit or increasing the cost of ownership to unbelievable levels (like NYC)
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:01 PM   #35
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Whoa!! Red Barchetta!!!


I'll be one of those hard-heads who hangs on til the last minute. I hate public transportation.
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:03 PM   #36
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Less Driving = Car last longer

Car last longer = Dont have to buy one as often

Dont have to buy one as often = Car makers sell less cars.
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:23 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damemorder


The problem you'll find is getting people to want it.
Exactly. People are so used to what they have, it'* hard to change. That is backed up by the kind of responses I have received about this topic. People just don't want it. However, considering the way things are going in this world right now, we need to come up with something eventually. Spreading awareness is the best thing an individual can do. Just by talking about this on this forum, people become aware.
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:28 PM   #38
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just thought id chime in, even if i have nothing new to add.

public transportation will never work in america unless its a) privately owned (reduce the strain on the government and remove "big business" from the negative side of the equation), or b) its touted as being patriotic (see the draft going into WW1, or Wilson'* War as i like to call it).

public transportation was tried, and was proven as effective in America and it was REPLACED by the automobile. it was replaced because of incredible attempts by american automakers to make a profit and gain a basic monopoly over transportation. and how was it replaced? the automakers touted a car as being the epitome of the "American Dream" and *gasp* it was privately owned.

the reason it wont work again? auto-makers are too big now. they have too much power (see the tobacco industry) with our government (see where the tax on gas goes). it is directly against their best interests to promote mass transit. ergo its against the politicians best interests to promote mass transit, unless the American public raises an outcry far better than they have over Iraq or Vietnam. we wont be fighting politicians who will have to be re-elected, we will be fighting the industries we support and have made it so we cant live without those industries (jobs, tranportations).

i have mixed feelings about this. im sad to see the possibility it will end, but i also think its pretty much time for it to end. we dont have to get rid of our awesome cars, but who needs a Hummer? no one except the military, but our hummers are really not that related to the military hummer and it will continue growing away from them (see Jeep). There'* a point where things need to be changed and i think we were at that point 15 years ago but there was no incentive to change. Now that the average american is concerned about their pocket-book, its incentive to change. but not to go away from the american dream of being wasteful -- its incentive for car-makers to pretend they care.

i love my car. its expensive to change, and were already operating under a deficit. there are no businesses right now with the clout or balls to fund a change and our government cant afford it either. but im glad to see some sort of effort on someones part to bring about change, even if its ultimately pointless in this avenue.

how will history view the 2000'* for America? a period of time where change was ushered in, or the period of time where America had the incentive for change and failed to do so? i vote for change.
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:50 PM   #39
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something interesting i read;

Quote:
Originally Posted by NHTSA.dot.gov
Since 1983, manufacturers have paid more than $500 million in civil penalties. Most European manufacturers regularly pay CAFE civil penalties ranging from less than $1 million to more than $20 million annually. Asian and domestic manufacturers have never paid a civil penalty.
some perspective on where american car companies lay in the global picture.

check this out: http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/...2003/index.htm

either cafe is biased toward GM (unlikely at best), or GM is actually pretty dang good. theres a particularly interesting table about 2/3rds of the way down the page on that link. also note that import MPG actually peaked in early 90'* and have decreased since then. makes me rethink what i thought i knew about imports. curious to see whats happened since.
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:55 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bandit
Less Driving = Car last longer

Car last longer = Dont have to buy one as often

Dont have to buy one as often = Car makers sell less cars.
Let me just assure you of this real quick, If the cars last too long for GM to make money, The car won't last as long anymore

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol
Just by talking about this on this forum, people become aware.
People are also aware of cholesterol, But the line at McDonalds is pretty long. Warning about the impact of something doesn't really do much to the American mindset if they don't realize the immediate effects. Kinda like "don't push the big red button", If they don't drop down a chute into a drainage ditch they'll probably be pushing that button everytime you walk out of the room.
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