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'04 Classic intermittent cranking no-start

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Old 04-24-2019, 03:39 PM
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I guess I just need to know where SP302 is
Old 04-24-2019, 11:03 PM
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This sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I was almost posting a lonnnnnnnnnng post and I accidentally hit one of these freakin' ads.......I hit the back button and everything is gone! Pain in the freakin' ***!

Brief summary....there is nothing wrong with any of the four legs...no ground problem......

Back to my initial thought....looked at your first video....it looks like there ARE NO BOLTS holding your fuse block together.....they should be in there, and tight......if the fuse block is not the problem(you replaced relay and pump), then I would direct power the fuel pump.....we know which pins/legs are the f/p fuse, and the f/p relay control from the PCM(only lights for 2 seconds).......the other two legs go to ground and the F/P....we don't know which is which......

Key off.....ground one leg of your multimeter(set for ohms).......then probe the two legs that we don't know where they go......the one that shows zero ohms, is the ground circuit.....the one that shows 2-4 ohms(I'm guessing this is the resistance of the pump), is the pump circuit...make a note of that........in any case, the one with the higher resistance is the one going to the pump.....

Now turn key to "on"..........You are going to take a jumper and jump the leg that has the fuel pump fuse(you can check with a test light to verify), and you are going to put the other end of the jumper in the fuse block leg that has the fuel pump circuit......you should hear the fuel pump run, and there should be pressure....if you don't, you have an open between the leg in the fuse block and the fuel pump...........
Old 04-25-2019, 03:03 AM
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Thank you for the help so far by the way, you should look into uBlock Origin for those ads, it'* my favorite Firefox add-on.

Anyway, fuse block holder bolts... you're referring to the 3 threaded holes in a row? in the central part of the fuse block? the fusebox lid threads into the center hole, but I can try and find some bolts that'll go that deep for the other two, haven't removed the block yet myself, maybe a previous owner or tech swiped them, jiggling the fuse block itself is possible, but has never shown any direct relationship to this problem.

Taking a reading on the two unknown legs, I get 0.2 ohms and 0.9 ohms average, they vary pretty wildly.

The leg with 0.9 ohms is definitely the fuel pump, it shows up on my pressure gauge noticeably when I jump it from supply. What confuses me is why the diagram on the relay shows the electromagnet on the fuel pump side and the switch on the ground side, unfortunately the little sucker is acting fine again, so I'll try again on a hot day and see if I can repeat the problem.
Old 04-25-2019, 10:57 AM
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If it'* heat related just grab a hair dryer or heat gun and start warming things up. Did you verify the fuse block don't have green death on the underside?
Old 04-25-2019, 06:30 PM
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Update: I found something.
I induced the problem this afternoon and I determined (with my test light) that the 2 second pcm signal going to the relay is weak or non-existent when the problem is occurring.
Old 04-25-2019, 09:05 PM
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Those bolts hold the blocks(these hold all your connections) on the backside tight to the fuse block, otherwise they can become loose and cause intermittent problems...
Old 04-26-2019, 04:56 PM
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Confirmed:
Using my test light, I confirmed that the 2 second Signal from the PCM was not reaching the Fuel Pump relay, and I can also confirm that high temps under the dash are noticeably related to how bad the problem is.

No progress yet on the fuse box hold-down bolts, have to check the junkyard for them. Can't seem to find the release to remove the box either... any help on that would be awesome.

I suppose my next move is to remove the PCM and inspect the connections there?
Old 04-27-2019, 08:54 AM
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No, I would concentrate on the fuse block, first.......

You would have to find the control wire from the PCM going into the fuse block.......

You want C1 connector(blue), terminal 46, dark green/white tracer.....

get a piercing tool for that wire.......now attach your grounded test light to the piercing tool.....now turn the key to on, and see if you get power for 2 seconds.....if you do and you don't get power at the relay leg, you have found your problem.....if you don't get power at the piercing tool, then you will have to disconnect the PCM and do an ohm check between the piercing tool and the PCM harness.....if ok, now we need to scan for B and U codes to see if there is a possible Security problem....

But my money is on a fuse block connection.....
Old 04-27-2019, 09:44 PM
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The connectors bolt to the under hood fuse block from the bottom(under side after fuse block is pulled from bracket and cover removed). Have run across a few that had insufficient power from the ignition switch that only effect random circuits and were temperature related. Also those had issues with the hazard switch. Just a thought and hope you find this helpful. Wouldn't recommend piercing wires,have had to repair way too many wiring issues from this,go to a connector and back probe with a pin is a better option in my opinion. you seem to be getting valuable info.
Old 04-28-2019, 03:58 AM
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That makes sense, how do I get this fuse block off of the bracket anyway? when I tried I only managed to bend the bracket, not looking to break anything I don't have to ya know? the only video I found on it was... well... poorly lit and only a little informative.


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