any '92-'99 H-bodies with a 60*V6 swapped in? - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


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Old 02-11-2007, 09:06 PM   #1
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Default any '92-'99 H-bodies with a 60*V6 swapped in?

yeah, it'* crazy but....

does anyone know of someone who has swapped a 60*V6 into a '92-'99 H-body?

what i'd like to do is custom install a '96+ 3400 'LA1' engine into a '92-'95 Bonneville SSE or SSEi. the thing is, i really like that style of Bonneville (i guess you could say i am SET on getting one as a next project car even if it means ending up using a 3800), yet i want to use a turbocharged 3400 with a 4T60 (non-E) automatic transmission. it would have to be a non-E 4T60 since i'd plan on using OBD-1 electronics to run the 3400. i'd be using an '89-'93 3.1 MPFI 'LH0'/4T60 engine wiring harness, 1227727 ECM along with an EEPROM loaded with modified $8f TGP code (aka Turbo Grand Prix with 3.1L MPFI Turbo 3.1 'LG5' engine). this is a batch fired speed density 2-bar MAP system; no MAF or SFI. all of this would be used with larger injectors and an AFPR if required. a swap like this would be different (which i like) and besides i'm more familiar with the 60*V6 after owning my Cutlass for so long and modifying it. that'* not to say i have anything against the 3800 like alot of other people do (otherwise i wouldn't own my Regal GS!) but i do have a 3400 sitting in my garage. Mahle makes forged 9.0:1 pistons for the 3400, and i know the rest of the engine is good for alot of power including the stock forged rods, cast crankshaft and block. i'd be shooting for about 350whp and maybe 400wtq using something like a Garrett GT30R and a large FMIC with less than 14psi. i'm assuming the regular non-E 4T60 could be built to handle that power or no way? i might resort to swapping in a Getrag 282 or 284...it would be alot more fun, less drivetrain loss and alot lighter but alot more custom work too. i'm not an experienced welder/fabricator by any means but i do know of some places that i've had do good work.

then there is the engine mounts...i know the W-bodies could come with either the 60*V6 or 3800, so maybe i could do something to swap mounts/bracketry around between car lines/engines but i'm doubting it. can anyone here post a pic of a '92-'95 Series-I H-body engine bay without the engine installed? i'd really like to get a good look at the cradle for the lower engine mount. i know the 3400 is supported from the passenger side area near the body/strut tower on my mom'* '99 Grand Am GT, as well as the 'L27' in my brother'* '94 Bonneville SSE. i'll be studying these and taking pics/measurements of these two cars to try to figure something out, and of course visiting the local salvage yard to compare other cars etc. then there is the dogbone engine mounts that the 3400 uses whereas the '92-95 H-body doesn't. as for the transmission mount and axles, that shouldn't be a problem should it? so long as the transmission is mounted in the same place, i should just be able to use '92-'95 4T60-E Bonneville axles. or at least i hope.

i'm not too worried about the wiring aspect but for the sake of simplicity should i stick with an already OBD-1 '92/'93 Bonneville? i have never done an OBD swap but i think i could handle it. i've done alot of wiring and i don't mean just stereos.

TIA for any info, suggestions etc. i know getting the same amount of power with a 3800 would be alot easier & cheaper but this kind of swap intrigues me i guess. after turbocharging & 5-speed swapping my Cutlass (which was basically all bolt in/easy stuff for the most part) i want to tackle something more challenging.
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:18 PM   #2
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The first question I'd ask you (with all due respect) is why you'd want to swap in that more troublesome engine when the drivetrain options for the Bonneville will net more power, greater reliability, and far lest investment?
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:34 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
The first question I'd ask you (with all due respect) is why you'd want to swap in that more troublesome engine when the drivetrain options for the Bonneville will net more power, greater reliability, and far lest investment?
i tend to think the opposite (with all due respect) besides the investment part of course. i kind of already answered that question in the first post anyway. obviously i'm going to have to invest alot of time and some money into this, but just how involved is it?
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:37 PM   #4
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The one major problem you would have to overcome is the passenger side torque axis mount. I don't know how you would, if you could, adapt it to the pulley side of a 3.1.
Trans mounts would be cake but the t/a mount makes it very hard.
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:41 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95naSTA
The one major problem you would have to overcome is the passenger side torque axis mount. I don't know how you would, if you could, adapt it to the pulley side of a 3.1.
Trans mounts would be cake but the t/a mount makes it very hard.
is the torque arm mount on the front/lower side of the 3800 engine, IOW basically does what the 3400 dogbone motor mounts do? yeah....that could be a big problem. i wish i had my brother'* car here to look at but i probably won't have the chance to do that soon.
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:44 PM   #6
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It does more than the dog bone mounts do. It supports the engine on the p/* and prevents it from torquing back.
Thats the only thing supporting the engine on that side.
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Old 02-11-2007, 09:48 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95naSTA
It does more than the dog bone mounts do. It supports the engine on the p/* and prevents it from torquing back.
Thats the only thing supporting the engine on that side.
so is there any mount at all on the front side of the 3800 engine? it almost sounds like doing both or just using dogbones would be better and possibly easier. the dogbones do the same thing, just a different way of doing it.
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Old 02-11-2007, 10:25 PM   #8
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The front radiator core support on the Bonneville wasn't designed for dogbones like the W body. It will not support the load. The only front mount on the Bonneville is the front lower trans mount on the driver'* side.

The 3400 produces far less torque, less hp, and has far less in the aftermarket than the 3800, and the 3800 doesn't have the head issues the 3400 has.

There is no replacement for displacement, particularly when displacement also comes forced with an Eaton.
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Old 02-11-2007, 11:50 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboSedan
the dogbones do the same thing, just a different way of doing it.
They DONT do the same thing. If you just had dogbones in the H-body engine bay the p/* of the engine will not be supported. There are two mounts on the drivers side that hold the engine up but the t/a mount is the ONLY thing holding the engine vertically up on the p/*.
There is also a dogbone mount underneath on the p/*. It only helps with torquing, not supporting.
And as mentioned, the core support isn't designed to keep the engine from torquing back. I'm sure you could strengthen it up though.
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Old 02-12-2007, 01:35 AM   #10
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Turbo the 3800 in ur SSE/i you want.
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