Cold Weather TCC Lock Up - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


1992-1999 Series I L27 (1992-1994 SE,SLE, SSE) & Series II L36 (1995-1999 SE, SSE, SLE) and common problems for the Series I and II L67 (all supercharged models 92-99) Including Olds 88's, Olds LSS's and Buick Lesabres Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-28-2007, 05:42 PM   #11
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Somewhere different on the globe every month....
Posts: 2,896
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cheetah is on a distinguished road
Default

Right around 180F for engine temp or 12 mins of driving
Cheetah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2007, 07:40 PM   #12
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, Mi
Posts: 5,656
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Archon is on a distinguished road
Default

Its about the same for my 2000. The engine temp will be normal, but it will still take about another few minutes before lockup. The 12 minutes sounds about right for mine, too.
Archon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2007, 08:48 PM   #13
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
banned3800 is on a distinguished road
Default

Now that brings me to the question.... Does super cold lockup add more wear and tear to the trans?

__________________
Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
banned3800 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2007, 09:44 PM   #14
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, Mi
Posts: 5,656
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Archon is on a distinguished road
Default

I've wondered about what the benefits to a later lockup may be, also. I don't know if there is a difference in the 65e that makes it necessary, or beneficial. The '89 SE, and '91 GP all locked up earlier and both went over 250k miles without any tranny work. The '96 Buick Regal had 180k on it when I sold it, also without tranny work. So, at least with those, an earlier lockup didn't seem to hurt them any.
Archon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2007, 10:53 PM   #15
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
banned3800 is on a distinguished road
Default

Yeah the THM440T4( 4T60 ) was simply looking for the engine to be at the proper operating temps... I believe that 150F is the sweet spot for it..

On my 95, When the L36 first came out it was said the when the Cat was up to temp, the emissions was down as low as .0002 grams per mile iirc.. I think they were trying to lower emissions and increrase fuel milage at the time, but they didn't have the 4T65-E yet..

I have always been able to cold start and hit OD with TCC lock at 55-60 no matter what the temperature.. I left a Motel in NC One morning... It was cold too... I hit the interstate in a minute or so.... Got up to speed and Poof OD with TCC Lock...

GM may have adapted some programming in there to make sure the trans is at a minimum operating temp before it will apply the TCC clutch... But I can't fathom why they'd do that, and have a design that allows for a given amount of slip in the TCC... You'd think if the engine was warm enough you'd be able to hit TCC lock with no issues..

__________________
Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
banned3800 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2007, 11:46 PM   #16
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, Mi
Posts: 5,656
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Archon is on a distinguished road
Default

Some of it may be explained here...
Electronic Component Description

About half way down is the description for the Torque Converter Clutch Pulse Width Modulation Solenoid Valve. It indicates that the fluid has to be at the proper temperature for it to apply. The only reason I can think of for GM going to this is to reduce the "chuggle" complaints during lockup. Perhaps it can only do it'* job properly when the fluid is at operating temperature?

The last description is for the Automatic Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor. It gives a brief description of its operation, and what is "too hot". Other than that, the only useful information is "The PCM uses this input in order to help determine the proper line pressure, shift schedules and TCC apply."


Edit - Using information from Mapquest, on a cold day, it will take 14 minutes and 9 miles before the car goes into lockup. Of that 2 miles is city driving, and the remaining 12, highway.
Archon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2007, 01:14 AM   #17
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Somewhere different on the globe every month....
Posts: 2,896
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cheetah is on a distinguished road
Default

Does the givven amout of slip keep the trans up to temp, and does the slip vary with the temp of the trans fluid?
Cheetah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2007, 02:32 AM   #18
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, Mi
Posts: 5,656
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Archon is on a distinguished road
Default

So far, I haven't been able to find information regarding what things the PCM looks at to control the amount of slip. Other than what I posted above, this is about all that I've found so far.

Quote:
All vehicles equipped with a 4T65-E transmission have an Electronically Controlled Capacity Clutch (ECCC) system. In the ECCC system, the pressure plate does not fully lock to the torque converter cover. It is instead, precisely controlled to maintain a small amount of slippage between the engine and the turbine, reducing driveline torsional disturbances.
Archon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2007, 07:34 PM   #19
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
banned3800 is on a distinguished road
Default

The good thing about the way the 65-E is controled is the fact that it can fall into a lock of sorts allowing for a given amount of slip at lower speeds than a 60-E could... This gives the 65-E the ability to lock or reduce the amount of slip or losses in the converter at low speeds improving the around town mieage...

4T60'* and 4T60-E'* are not capeable of this..

__________________
Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
banned3800 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Any way to program tcc lock up for surging issue? Boostinta Buick 1 10-01-2013 07:35 PM
TCC problem p0742 tcc stuck in locked position San Juan Cruiser 2000-2005 8 10-20-2007 01:00 PM
TCC only works when cold swanthog 1992-1999 13 06-18-2005 07:41 PM
cold weather..wobbly steering.. bonnieboy23 1987-1991 3 07-20-2003 09:14 PM
Code 39 and only runs well in cold weather Kuhl 1992-1999 13 05-09-2003 01:36 AM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:46 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.