1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


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Old 04-10-2016, 10:29 AM   #11
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Question is, is he going to step up to the plate, if it'* the same connecting rod problem? Otherwise you may have to go to small claims court....
I'm not sure what the protocol is. If I were one of his automotive repair shop customers--not a shade tree mechanic--would he pay for the tremendous amount of labor involved in pulling the engine, et. al.? I suspect that machine shops would redo the bad machine shop work, but wouldn't fork out any money for labor.

If it turns out that the same rod caused a bearing to spin, I have no doubt that he'll fix the rod and the crank, and probably give me a new gasket kit, but I don't see him writing me a check for my trouble. If he offered to give me my money back ($975), I'd just cut my losses, roll this car to a salvage yard, and start looking for another car.

Small claims is an option, but collecting on a judgement is easier said than done, and I prefer to resolve things amicably.
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Old 04-10-2016, 10:30 AM   #12
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I hope your mechanic helps you sort things out, seems like he should cover a lot of the work that needs to be done again, because if he did it right the first time there would be no problems.


If you lived in VA I'd sell you my 96' Park Ave, its motor is in great shape, and the transmission still shifts nicely, only has 139k on it, and I have owned it since 27k, before that my Moms Husbands parents owned it..
I'm tying to get 1,200.00 for it, but for a good cause I'd consider 1,000.00
It needs a little work though, the seats need to come out, carpet needs cleaning, and a water leak needs to be found and fixed.
As well as any grounds under the carpet will need to be cleaned up, as the interior lights quit working.
It could easily be fixed up enough to be a reliable car to get somebody back and forth to work..
I'll try to post some pics and info on my car in our for sale section here sometime.
Sounds like a good car. I'm a days drive from you here in Pensacola, FL. Thanks for the consideration.
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Old 04-10-2016, 01:10 PM   #13
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I checked the dipstick this morning. Oil is grey. Not a good sign.
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Old 04-11-2016, 03:10 PM   #14
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Default Drained and inspected the oil

The best way to describe this oil is that it kind of looks like metallic paint. Looks like powdered metal floating around in the oil--a lot of powdered metal.

My machinist asked me to text him some pictures of the oil. He said he'* never seen anything like this. Ever.
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Old 04-11-2016, 05:42 PM   #15
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^ That'* amazing.. kinda an oil bucket / art photo...but not good.
Sadly, that engine'* got to be taken apart to find out whats really going on.

Last edited by Soft Ride; 04-11-2016 at 05:43 PM. Reason: add a word
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Old 04-11-2016, 08:46 PM   #16
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^ That'* amazing.. kinda an oil bucket / art photo...but not good.
Sadly, that engine'* got to be taken apart to find out whats really going on.
You sound like Morgan Freeman. "Sadly, the penguin did not survive the journey."

Dropping the oil pan next, but first I have to remove A/C compressor and bracket, lower right torque strut bracket, starter motor, and flywheel cover. Easy as pie.
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Old 04-12-2016, 08:57 AM   #17
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The rod bearing failed because it was not recondition.
And it had no bearing crush.
The shop is a better off not doing what they don't know how to do!!!!
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Old 04-13-2016, 03:51 PM   #18
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Default Dropped the pan today

I dropped the pan and inspected what was left in the bottom. Still, no large pieces of bearing, just very fine powdery aluminum suspended in the oil.

The knocking rod wasn't the no. 3 rod that we suspected. It was the no. 4 rod. The bearing wasn't spun at all. Both halves were still present and fully intact. They were just wobbled out on the inside. Here you can see the no. 4 lower bearing half compared to the no. 1. It'* quite a bit thinner.



Also shown is the no. 4 journal and the no. 1 journal. I'm hoping that I can get away with polishing with emery cloth because the aluminum bearing cushioned the journal and prevented steel-to-steel banging, hopefully, maybe? I sent photos to my machinist and he is going to call me back.





So, I guess he did a good enough job on the old, damaged connecting rod and the problem lies elsewhere. I'm not sure what I could have done wrong to cause this. They're pretty much idiot proof, with both halves being identical and a tang preventing you from installing them incorrectly. Any ideas?

I hand-primed the oil pump, then later turned over the engine (without spark plugs installed) until the oil pressure light went out. I just got off the phone with him, and he asked if I washed out the oil passages in the crankshaft to make sure they weren't clogged because he suggested it was starved for oil. That thought never crossed my mind because it was a new crank kit. The no. 4 piston is the closest to the oil pump, btw.

Well, I already bought my daughter'* boyfriend a decent '94 Corolla for $1000 (with me as lien holder) because he works two jobs and needs transportation. We'll be selling this car on craigslist. I just hope I can fix this problem quickly without having to pull the engine again. I'm $975 into it already, $400 of which has been paid back already, but I don't feel good about taking his money with the car being screwed up. But he insists on paying me back regardless.

Edit: was just told that the bearing is only aluminum faced with steel backing, so I guess there was steel-on-steel knocking.
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1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare-cdca0fd3-b733-4715-8110-4c7330ba383c_zps76y4gwuo.jpg   1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare-3dc17adb-7765-4371-92d2-236ed5d3b9b4_zpswvcn1rfm.jpg   1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare-fd55a887-d76f-4e0b-a82f-2062839e9a99_zpsct0blajs.jpg  
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Old 04-13-2016, 11:10 PM   #19
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The crank journal looks shot......no emery cloth is saving that.....quick out is a junkyard motor....

When a new crank is installed, and new bearings are installed, those journals should be plasti-gauged or use micrometers to do so........
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Old 04-21-2016, 09:41 PM   #20
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Default What value on learning?

I belatedly learned through my online research that you're not supposed to oil the backside of bearings. I did...with 90 weight gear oil. My machine shop guy said doing that would ruin a bearing quickly because it makes the bearing too tight. Is this true? If so, it'* an expensive, and valuable lesson. Funny that I did the same thing on 9 bearings, but only one failed. I did everything else correctly though.

One thing I discovered that was not quite right was that coolant had been seeping into the intake manifold via the EGR valve housing that shares space with a coolant passage. Although I torqued to specifications the little 8 mm bolts that attach the water jacket to the side of the cylinder head, coolant seeped into the EGR passageway and all over the outside of the engine. The gasket is one of those dark grey fiberous gaskets, and it was sopping wet with coolant when I scraped it off. The plugs were wet, as were the intake manifold passages leading to the cylinders. I also smelled burning coolant the last time he drove up to my house. I'm weary of using the same type of gasket on this second reassembly. I wonder if I could make one using a cork/rubber sheet? Opinions?

BTW, I decided to pull the engine and do it right because I cannot look a stranger in the eye and lie like a rug about what I know about this engine. I've been screwed a few times on used car purchases (people disabling air bag light and CEL pointing to a bad transmission), but I just can do that to someone else.

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1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare-img_2490.jpg   1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare-img_2491.jpg   1996 Sunfire 2.2L rebuild nightmare-img_2493.jpg  
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