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Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning Talk about modifications, or anything else associated with performance enhancements. Have a new idea for performance/reliability? Post it here. No idea is stupid! (please use Detailing and Appearance for cosmetic ideas)

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Old 02-06-2007, 02:02 PM   #21
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The benefits far outweigh your fears. I've seen no evidence of any of your concerns on any of the 7000+ cars on this Forum. Not even a hint of any issues.

Want to know the real experience of the Forum? Start a poll in General Chat. We've been running these things for years.

I think it would be safe to say that you're perhaps our one and only dissenting member on the 180 thermostat issue. And that would be based on real-world application and experience. Not theory.

Your car, your choice.
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Old 02-06-2007, 02:26 PM   #22
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While your concerns are valid they are too "old school" for your OBDII engine.

If your cooling system had the capacity and if you put in a low enough thermostat you could keep the PCM in warm up mode. (this is what causes it to run rich)

However, this is a rather extream condition and it will set a check engine light.
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Old 02-06-2007, 03:10 PM   #23
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The closest analogy I can think of is that you shouldn't move from San Francisco to Denver because you'll suffocate from lack of oxygen.
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Old 02-06-2007, 03:19 PM   #24
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I did the intake gaskets and valve cover gaskets at roughly 140ish K.... I bought the car as a former rental.. I went with the 180 T stat and have run it the entire time I have owned the car... This is what the inside of my motor looked like when I pulled the lower intake..




Here is the head.... Not bad for the Mileage, years and abuse..


Even with the 180 T-Stat, I pulled down 33 Mpg in 35-45F weather with 60-80 Rpms of trans slip between the input and output shaft...

This car has always burned 3/4 of a quart in 3000 miles... Did it when I bought it and still does it now

Thats what the bottom of the lower looked like when I yanked it


At 154k I'll keep the 180F... By the time I ever see 200k I will most like rebuild anyhow

But yes I will also agree to disagree

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Old 02-06-2007, 04:25 PM   #25
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that lifter valley looks about the same as mine did at 120k when i had my LIM off
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Old 02-06-2007, 04:27 PM   #26
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Yeah 3800'* aren't known for building sludge or beating the life out of the oil... I have seen a couple that looked like they never had an oil change.... But they are few and far between..

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Old 02-06-2007, 04:46 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
The closest analogy I can think of is that you shouldn't move from San Francisco to Denver because you'll suffocate from lack of oxygen.
You won't suffocate, but suppose an athlete trained all their life down in San Francisco and then went up to run a marathon in Denver? They'd be rather out of breath.

In any event, I'm done with the thermostat issue. It'* not something I'm willing to chance. You all asked for my reasons and I gave them. My standpoint isn't based entirely on theory either, but regardless I'm done with that.

Quote:
Speaking of my plenum, it'* been almost five years since it'* been replaced. How long do those things last, usually? I don't want to let it get to the point of hydrolocking the engine.

I understand that the L67 does not experience such difficulties, further reason for me to get the swap. I've also heard of people doing a "top end" swap...how difficult would this be if say, the UIM failed and the upper part of the engine was off anyway? Would it be just a direct fit or would other modifications need to be done? There would probably be a necessity for a PCM change and of course the drivebelt configuration. Fuel pump and injectors maybe? Just a thought, it would be easier than a full engine swap.
Any thoughts?
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Old 02-06-2007, 04:51 PM   #28
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Only one peron who posts on this forum has sucessfully done a top-end swap. Do some research on ClubGp for more information as they have many Top-end swap cars.

or you can adapt this kit.

http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/...kit-p-157.html
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Old 02-06-2007, 04:59 PM   #29
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Thanks for the information! From the looks of things though, it may actually be cheaper just to do an engine swap.

Maybe this summer....
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Old 02-06-2007, 05:03 PM   #30
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The engine swap is the most often chosen avenue on BC, by far. It'* not too bad for an experienced person. Plus you get the added benefit of having the HD transmission along with the L67, if you go with a complete swap from a donor car.
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