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Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning Talk about modifications, or anything else associated with performance enhancements. Have a new idea for performance/reliability? Post it here. No idea is stupid! (please use Detailing and Appearance for cosmetic ideas)

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Old 06-26-2004, 12:58 AM   #21
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The only thing we didn't install ourselves on the GTP was the headers, and we don't regret it one bit. I believe my dad paid $200 to get them installed at a shop in detroit, and they welded it up too, so it was really a pretty good deal. I certainly wouldn't do that much work when someone else will do it for about double what just getting it welded will cost. Just my opinion though.

Quote:
Other than heads, what else are you thinking?
Lots of things. When people thing of making more power what do they immediately think of....things that aren't necessary yet. You need to maximize your current setup before just throwing awesome heads and a huge cam in it. You were smart (IMO) by sticking with pretty much all stock internals and going with a mild cam that is similar to the stock cam. You have a lot of big power adding mods on your car, and thats great, they added large amounts of power and your car really doesn't run too bad, however you can't ignore the little things. What major stuff have we done to the GTP? Intercooler, Headers, 1.9 rockers....everything else is little stuff, a LOT of little stuff. 2hp here, 5hp there, etc...

There are a LOT of small things that I believe would help your car...here are just a couple.

*Ported & Polished Supercharger (or MP112 or M112 Hybrid...honestly I would do a M112 hybrid before a P&P'ed blower)
*Ported Intake Manifold to match ported outlet on supercharger (basically use the machined intake for the intercooler)
*Ported & Polished Throttle Body
*Insulated Air Intake Box to keep engine heat away from the intake (makes a huge KR difference)
*Electric Water Pump (less drag on the engine AND better cooling)
*Underdrive Alternator Pulley

Really what I should do is give you a mod list of what the GTP has done to it, because that is a perfect example of maximizing your current setup. I will try to see if I can come up with one since it has SO much done to it, I tend to forget things unless someone else mentions them. As im sure you already know, that engine has never been torn apart further than what can be done by taking the valve covers off. It has stock crank, rods, pistons, heads, valves, cam, etc...., it just has a good intake & exhaust setup to feed that setup properly. However it is at the point now where things that would normally give huge gains on cars without many mods are giving virtually no gain because the setup is pretty much maxed out. We are at the point now where it is looking like 11'* with stock cam/heads, an M90, and a basically full weight car (minus spare tire and all that usual stuff) isn't realistic. Now 11'* are possible with the exact same run and a reasonable 60', but thats asking for a lot of things to be right, and the car wouldn't be consistantly high 11'*, so whats the fun. So look for a mild cam or M112 hybrid in the future for that car.

Shawn
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Old 06-26-2004, 09:31 AM   #22
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The car is making a ton of power and would easily put a GP into the high 12'*. The problem is getting it to the ground and learning to launch it. Since the get go, my main reason for modding after the 3.4 was getting rid of KR and it hasnt happened. Rockers were supposed to do it, then headers, then the cam, I think my last ditch effort will be an intercooler. Right now im concentrating on the tranny and an LSD to help get power down for launches and for longevity.

The small stuff seems fine but there is no point in spending the money on porting the SC when a gen v is possibly in my future. Id rather spend the money on tranny stuff and other mods that will maximize the potential when that happens. N* TB also in the future so no point in porting the stock TB.
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Old 06-26-2004, 12:29 PM   #23
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dbtk2, you gotta get your STE faster to catch that GTP!

Rogue, what kind of CAI do you have? Have you ever considered a setup like Silverbullets? That might help out a little with the KR. What diameter are your exhaust pipes? could it be that you are maxed out there?
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Old 06-26-2004, 12:42 PM   #24
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Quote:
Rogue, what kind of CAI do you have? Have you ever considered a setup like Silverbullets? That might help out a little with the KR. What diameter are your exhaust pipes? could it be that you are maxed out there?
Sorry for stealing Rogues reply que but he is still running the stock 21/4" into twin 2" pipes.
My CAI works well but it wouldn't last long if it weren't for the solid motor mount. The engine flex would tear it up. He should go with a FWI system like I think he is planning.
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Old 06-26-2004, 12:45 PM   #25
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ok. correct me if I am wrong but the intake temps are the best way to get rid of KR (besides an intercooler), right?

A FWI for our cars would be nice...
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Old 06-27-2004, 12:09 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macho_mike21
ok. correct me if I am wrong but the intake temps are the best way to get rid of KR (besides an intercooler), right?

A FWI for our cars would be nice...
Yes, the lower he can get the air intake temps the better. I would recomend an insulated thrasher box (IIRC Taylor did that to his box...but I'm not sure, I showed him what we did on the GTP to give him an idea). We have an insulated thrasher CAI on the GTP and the intake temps are usually 2-6* above ambient air temps...and even people with fenderwell intakes can't say that.

Honestly, I don't think a FWI would be nice on these cars. They are nice due to the low intake temps, but they really don't flow a lot of air. A box is better in terms of airflow, and if you insulate it properly it can be just as good, if not better than a FWI in terms of heat, so thats why I would go with a box. Zooomer ran a FWI until last year when someone showed him how much better an insulated CAI was, and he switched to it...and now he won't go back.

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dbtk2, you gotta get your STE faster to catch that GTP!
Not planning on it. I enjoy having a transmission that works properly (the tranny in my car is weak, and with much more power than stock it will give out easily), and I can't afford tires every month, and I really don't need to put that much stress on the engine itself since its not exactly new, and wasn't exactly a strong engine when it was new. I am hoping for a 13.99 and then I am done with the car engine wise, might do some suspension modifications and maybe do some nice things to the interior and put a couple decals on the outside, but nothing major. The car is probably going to turn into my winter beater in the next couple years so I want to make it quick but still very driveable without dumping tons of money into it. I'm actually gonna try to save up and get a 6 Speed LS1 F-Body w/T-tops...so no sense in dumping a bunch of money into my 3.1L....I would be happy with a 13.99 though. And unlike most others, when I say I'm done once I hit 13'*, I'm serious.

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The small stuff seems fine but there is no point in spending the money on porting the SC when a gen v is possibly in my future. Id rather spend the money on tranny stuff and other mods that will maximize the potential when that happens. N* TB also in the future so no point in porting the stock TB.
I completely understand that. Obviously it would be stupid to P&P your throttle body and blower if you're just planning on upgrading them in the future anyways. However, I think I would try to get the car dialed in, the transmission built and the different blower & tb on there and maybe and intercooler before I put different heads on it...the heads aren't necessary for what you are trying to do IMO...you're not trying to build an 11 second SSEi like Scott...unless there is something you haven't told us.

Shawn
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Old 06-27-2004, 01:29 AM   #27
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Taylor, about the tranny stick tube. I just did my ported manifolds today, and had to pull the tube out. I lost about a quart of fluid, so have an extra quart of fluid and pan to catch it (you don't want to be rolling around in it like I was ) and this was before the car was jacked up. We got a rag there in the hole but if the fluid is coming out, it'll come out.
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Old 06-27-2004, 02:04 AM   #28
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Quote:
I lost about a quart of fluid, so have an extra quart of fluid and pan to catch it (you don't want to be rolling around in it like I was ) and this was before the car was jacked up. We got a rag there in the hole but if the fluid is coming out, it'll come out.
Yes it will come out unless your backend is raised a little higher than the front end. It also helps to stick in a rubber hose that fits the hole tight or cork it.

PS...just got back from a cool sunset run. The temp has cooled to 18 C or 65 F. What a great run. No knock retard. I keep the fans on high speed manually for an extra cool intake. 1st gear pulled to 6000 rpm shift. 2nd came up at 5800 rpm and shifted into 3rd at 97 mph, pulling strong to 120 (200 kph) until I let off the gas, 14 sec later.

...OK I was already doing 60 kph.
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Old 06-27-2004, 11:04 AM   #29
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Thanks for the tips everyone, Togs going in in 2 hours!
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Old 06-28-2004, 12:05 AM   #30
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Got them in, any updates?
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