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Old 03-22-2013, 09:11 PM   #1
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Default 96 park avenue- fuel leak and a couple questions

Car has been idling a lil off for a while, nothing major. Almost a week ago It began running really rough, enough to worry me. Picked up new plugs and wires as they were still original it appeared. While at the parts store I had the codes checked (flashing and steady check engine light). Codes were explained as follows:

Misfire on cylinder 3
Misfire on all (or multiple, dont remember exactly) cylinders
Something about bank 1....they called it an oxygen sensor code

Ok so I brought the plugs and wires home and put em on, checked after that and still no spark on cylinder 3. While working I noticed a fuel leak where the line connects to fuel rail, i've never had this apart( I laid the entire fuel assembly to the side when I did the manifolds) and it was getting dark so I left it alone.

Questions:

1. Anything else I should check before I run out and pick up a new coil pack in the morning?

2. I'm assuming there is an O-ring or something similar inside that fuel line connection, what should I ask for at the parts store and how does it come apart?

3. I'm thinking I'll do these repairs in the lot, then have them clear the codes and see what comes back in the next few days......sound about right?

Thank you and i'll keep you updated on the progress.

Rick
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:20 PM   #2
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i wouldnt worry about the coil until you fix the fuel leak as that can be the cause. i would use a pick or screwdriver get the oring out and take it with you, they have fuel specific orings.

3. good plan, misfire is instant though after scanner clear the code it will come back immediately if not fixed. you can try moving the coil if its not fixed and see if the code moves.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:39 PM   #3
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A little supplemental FYI- The "something about bank 1....they called it an oxygen sensor code" is likely caused from your misfire. Unburndt fuel going into the exhaust. You may have to replace your catalytic converter as a result of the misfire if the misfire was going a long time.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:26 PM   #4
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I had this same issue with my 96' PA, that fuel rail leak is fairly common, mine was leaking for who knows how ling before I caught it, it would only leak if I pushed down on the fuel line, so I imagine whenever I'd hit bumps while driving it would leak a little, this is dangerous, so I'd get it fixed immediately.
Attached a pic of what mine looked like.

When I fixed my leak it was a pain to get the innermost o-ring that fails replaced, I used a pick to get both out, but getting that innermost one seated was too hard for me to do, so I tried using a Dorman fuel line tool, and fuel line kit to repair it, I learned that the tool was no good for the curved fuel line.
So I ended up cutting the nylon fuel line from the metal fuel line at the firewall, and I replaced it with proper psi rated fuel injection hose, you have to be sure to run the hose the same way the nylon one went, and you need to remove the plastic clip thing on the fuel rail, then put the hose on and clamp it down, it makes it tough to put the engine cover back on, I like to leave mine off of there though, so not being able to put the cover back on was not a big deal for me.

If you want to give replacing the o-rings a shot, I can try to find the thread I had on this same issue, it took me about 25.00 to finally get the right o-rings, this is partially due to being limited to getting them from the internet, as I did not have a second vehicle to go to a parts store.
You can find the right o-rings with a bit of searching, I tried a dealership and they said they can only replace the whole fuel line, they would not sell me the o-rings.

After you fix the fuel leak, replace the coil, clear the codes, and see how it runs.
I'd clean the MAF with some MAF cleaner, if possible replace the fuel filter, and remove the EVAP line from the fuel pressure regulator with it running, and wait a minute to see if any fuel comes out of the hose, if it does replace that fuel pressure regulator.
I'd inspect your EVAP hoses while at it, make sure none are dry-rotted.



I do not mean to get off topic, but has the car ever had the lower intake manifold gasket replaced?
If not that is something I'd add to the to do list ASAP.
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Old 03-23-2013, 02:07 PM   #5
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Update:

I ran out to the parts store this morning and went ahead and put a coil pack on it since it had no fire after new plugs and wires(tested with a spare plug in a new wire, it was dead as a doornail with the plug threads grounded and engine running). That seemed to fix all the misfire issues, running much better now.

Had a little trouble finding the o-rings for the quick connect, finally found the inner o-ring and replaced it (the brown one), that seems to have stopped the leak at least for now. I never did find a match to the outer yellow o-ring, but i'll keep looking.

Had the codes cleared and ran some errands around town, so far so good, no check engine light so far.

WilliamE,

I picked up a can of MAF cleaner; however, it and the fuel filter will have to wait since it has started raining here. I pulled the line from the regulator with no gas or smell of gas after waiting a short while, so it seems ok. The upper and lower manifolds were done a couple months ago, while I was at it I replaced the evap hoses and any other vacuum lines I could. I do have a few oddball vacuum fittings that are all to pieces and I can't seem to find them anywhere, they are wrapped with black tape right now trying to keep air tight. Any ideas where these could be gotten from?

I think that covers everything. Thanks again guys and I'll keep you updated on the check engine light when it comes back on and we'll go from there.

Thanks
Rick
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Old 03-23-2013, 05:20 PM   #6
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depends what you are talking about. the evap one that splits to the fpr you can get a tee that has different sizes on it, ive seen them at carquest but probably all have it. then get the bigger line for the tb its a different size for the purge vavle and fpr. i got a new one from the dealer but you have to get the whole plastic line kit, and it was like 30 bucks and i had to wait
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Old 03-24-2013, 11:40 AM   #7
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Glad to hear the coil pack fixed the misfire, and nice job replacing that innermost o-ring, I am not sure what I was doing wrong, it just refused to seat up in there for me.
The small yellowish o-ring was tough to find, I think I ended up with 2 or 3 of them left over, if you'd like I could mail you one, or try to find where I ordered the right one from.
If you are from the US, and want me to drop the o-ring in the mail, you can PM me with your address, and I'll send you one.

As for the EVAP connectors, you may as well replace them all, along with all of the soft EVAP hose, the hose and connectors are pretty cheap, I went to Auto Zone and took each connector I needed in, and matched the connectors, look in the HELP section for the connectors, for the hose, you can take a piece to the counter guy, and he should help you find the right size soft EVAP hose.
I may have ordered the one that is not a Tee connector to the throttle body from a GMParts store, I cannot remember if the auto parts store had that one, if you need it and cannot find it, I'll hunt it down.

If you do replace all EVAP hoses there are a few you may not see without looking for them, there is one that hooks into a plastic nipple in the wiring harness, it goes into the intake manifold, near the larger brake booster hose.
Of course you have the connector to the fuel pressure regulator, the Tee and other EVAP connector that goes to the throttle body.
After those are replaced look up under the rear right side of the car, you should see some soft EVAP hose running to a plastic Tee, car body, and a compressor for the air struts, this takes the same EVAP hose you will already have on hand, which is why I suggest replacing it, it dry rots being so exposed to the elements.
There may also be a bit of soft EVAP hose near the fuel tank/fuel filter area, I'll have to look when it is not raining to be sure, as it has been a while since I replaced them.

When you replace these, if you need me to get any pics of the one goes to that wiring harness let me know.
I'll attach a pic of the connector that hose comes from.
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Old 11-21-2013, 06:28 PM   #8
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Hello William E.
I am trying to figure out which hose connects to the fitting with the brake booster hose. I recently replaced upper and lower intake gaskets and must have forgot to do that hose and don't even remember unhooking one in the first place. I am guessing this is the reason for my P0171 code and poor mileage.
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Old 11-21-2013, 07:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MHunter View Post
Hello William E.
I am trying to figure out which hose connects to the fitting with the brake booster hose. I recently replaced upper and lower intake gaskets and must have forgot to do that hose and don't even remember unhooking one in the first place. I am guessing this is the reason for my P0171 code and poor mileage.
It comes out of the brake booster pictured in my previous post, and runs into the big part of the wiring harness in that area, where it runs inside the wire loom till it comes around to the front right, where the EVAP Canister is.
I'd inspect all of your soft EVAP lines/connectors, and replace them if they are dry-rotting, the hose is not that expensive at any auto-parts store, I found almost every soft EVAP line/connector I had were starting to dry-rot, if you have self leveling struts, then even the soft hose under the right rear of the car, that runs to and from the T connecting to the air compressor, if you get under there and look at it, you may want to check/replace the soft EVAP line that runs to the fuel tank, it is tough to reach, but if you have long arms it is easy to remove that soft part of the EVAP line, the line I am referring to runs alongside the fuel delivery and return lines.

I am posting this here since is somewhat relevant to the OP'* problem, if you need any help diagnosing your issue after that Matt, then please start a new thread, with that said, welcome to the forums!
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Old 11-21-2013, 07:34 PM   #10
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I recently replaced the other vacuum lines in the engine compartment that hook to the TB and FPR because I had damaged them when doing the gaskets but I still am unable to locate the vacuum line in your photo. I peeled the plastic cover off the wires and don't see any tubing or fittings running along with them.
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