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Old 02-09-2003, 03:14 AM   #41
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But Hector is right, too. our superchargers superheat the air anyway. It'* not really going to do us that much good. There'* a couple ways to beat that, though.
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Old 02-09-2003, 06:04 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
Buyt Hector is right, too. our superchargers superheat the air anyway. It'* not really going to do us that much good. There'* a couple ways to beat that, though.
Go turbo with a huge air-to-air intercooler in the front.

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Old 02-09-2003, 12:25 PM   #43
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Quote:
Buyt Hector is right, too. our superchargers superheat the air anyway. It'* not really going to do us that much good. There'* a couple ways to beat that, though.
Yes they do. They add heat to whatever the temperature of the air is to begin with.
So if the incoming charge is 130 F and the supercharger adds another 140 F = 270 F.

And if the incoming charge is 50 F and the supercharger adds the same 140 F = 190 F.

There is still a net gain.

Of Course adding an intercooler between the supercharger and the engine will cool the charge back down again.

Below is a quote from Thrasher:
Thermocouple testing has shown aftermarket intercoolers to reduce charged air temps up to 130 degrees F (from 270 down to 140)! This results in a dyno tested 40HP, with considerably less possibility for engine-destructing detonation, thereby allowing even more boost!

Will - That 130 degree drop equates to a 13% increase in power. Their claim is 40 Hp
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Old 02-09-2003, 01:58 PM   #44
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The problem we run into is that it'* not going to be a 1:1 ratio. Dropping the intake temp by a specific amount won't make a boosted level temp change of the same thing. The effective thermal mass, or thermal temperature capability of the Supercharger is probably too great for this. If you have a 50 lower intake temp for instance, it might make a 10 or 25 difference at the lower intake. On top of that is the mechanical heat the supercharger picks up from the drivetrain, and the heat it produces itself.

It'* not going to be linear. That SC is so capable of superheating the air, it'* not going to care too much about the incoming air temp. Not as much as you'd think, though.

Yes, it will help, but how much? We have to find a way to measure that air coming into the lower intake. We need somebody with an intercooler already installed that has a temp gauge in it. Turn off the pump and take some temp readings with and without the heatshield.
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Old 02-09-2003, 03:22 PM   #45
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Quote:
The problem we run into is that it'* not going to be a 1:1 ratio. Dropping the intake temp by a specific amount won't make a boosted level temp change of the same thing. The effective thermal mass, or thermal temperature capability of the Supercharger is probably too great for this. If you have a 50 lower intake temp for instance, it might make a 10 or 25 difference at the lower intake. On top of that is the mechanical heat the supercharger picks up from the drivetrain, and the heat it produces itself.
Sorry to disagree with you Will.

I pulled out my old Engineering Thermodynamics text and read up on Adiabatic compressor analysis.

It is a linear relationship.
All other factors are equal, that is, the supercharger is running at the same speed and the engine temp is also the same, before and after the bubble wrap mod.

With the lower temps I am running now, the supercharger housing is also running about 20 F cooler.

I would have thought that the 4 tenths time improvement in CAI cone from factory box, would be proof enough of a solid 20 hp gain
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Old 02-09-2003, 04:01 PM   #46
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I enjoy playing devil'* advocate. I'll go with you on this and not pull MY old books out!
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Old 02-09-2003, 04:09 PM   #47
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Is your 4 tenths improvement just the CAI or also with your 3.4" Pulley? And a quick question, you put Exhaust crossover Heat Shield in your mod list. The crossover is already heat shielded. Did you thermal wrap it or just say it'* heat shielded....

Ok, now your next project is an intercooler. :P (Well it'* my next project is Willwren would just turn his back on his car for a few days.....)
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Old 02-09-2003, 04:17 PM   #48
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I'm not looking! Should I hold off on my design and wait for yours?
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Old 02-09-2003, 04:27 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
I'm not looking! Should I hold off on my design and wait for yours?
Sure? It'* up to you. You can always just try both.
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Old 02-09-2003, 09:24 PM   #50
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I was searching for such topics online last week from work (gets slow sometimes). I found an interesting chart on website someplace, showing more or less linear relationship between intake temp and the temp/density of the cylinder charge.

Anyhow, the more interesting info was that the car they tested (Viper) would have to go 240 mph before the cold air intake was able to provide as much volume/pressure as the engine could use.

Makes me wonder what those figures would be for our cars. Also makes me wonder about putting NACA ducts to feed the intake. I'm waiting for a warmer day to have a good look underneath and see what I can come up with.
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