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Old 02-27-2012, 10:33 PM   #1
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Default engine swap

I just bought the neighbors 2002 bonneville with a rod knock. need to replace engine, a 3800. am looking for info on how to do the swap.have never done a front wheel drive swap before. what can i exspect time wise. online mechcanic said 4-5hrs. what can i expect to pay in labor cost? any good online site for technical help? thanks.
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Old 02-27-2012, 10:48 PM   #2
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We can help you just fine here. I've done a few. If you have the tools, it'* much easier. It'* fairly straight forward. From under, unplug all sensors and battery cables. Remove starter and inspection cover. Remove the 3 bolts holding the torque converter to the flex plate. Unbolt the engine mount on right side, 2 bolts in the sub frame. remove the bracket that holds trans diff cover to engine. On top, unplug all sensors and plugs, flop wiring harness on to the windshield. Unhook fuel lines, it'* under pressure, so remove the pressure first. Unbolt rear manifold from head, remove cross over pipe, leave rear manifold in the car. Hook up the engine lift. Remove the bolts holding engine to the transmission. There is one between the trans and engine facing the other direction. Use a pry bar to pop the seal between the engine and trans. I can have a engine out in about 2 hours or so.
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Old 02-28-2012, 02:54 AM   #3
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Welcome to GM Forum, Kaptain. Follow Dan'* advice; after all, he wrote the book on engine removal.

When you get a free minute, why not say hello? I think once you browse our Tech Info section, you might stay for a while.
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Old 02-28-2012, 12:56 PM   #4
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I'm a bit confused on Dan'* removal advice. He'* got a lot of good info, but there'* a few things not quite right.

Disconnect battery under rear seat
Reslease tension on belts and remove them (15mm/T47 torx, a 45 will work)
Jack and support the car.
Drain coolant and oil (preference is to pull the bottom rad hose at the rad, oil drain is either 13mm or 15mm)
Remove passenger tire and splash shield (trim clips)
Unbolt power steering pump (2 x 13mm through the pulley at 12 and 6 oclock, I leave these bolts in the pump) Note: pop the wire clipped to the back of the pump off the pump before moving it too much. That is your rear knock sensor connector. Disconnect it.
Hold pump up higher via bungee etc out of way
Now look straight in at the back of the motor
Unhook the oil pressure sensor
Remove the bracket from engine to trans with 4 13mm bolts. Two shorter ones into block, the other two are into the diff housing of the trans.

With that bracket out of the way, remove the 18mm bolt (from passenger side) that holds the engine to the trans.

Still sitting in the wheel well, remove the electrical connector to the AC compressor and the three 15mm nuts holding it to the bracket
Crawl under center of car and unbolt the downpipe to rear manifold nuts. They are typically 15mm or 13mm.
That concludes the back of the motor.

Hop under the front of the motor
Remove plastic starter and inspection shields with 3 10mm bolts.
You should now be able to see the 2 15mm starter bolts, remove them and the starter
Using a 13mm and 8mm remove the wiring from the starter
Using a 15mm remove the two bolts that hold the compressor to the bracket that is bolted to the block. Do not remove the freon or the nut holding the tubes to the compressor. Push it forward to the passenger side...off the studs (where you took off the 3 15mm nuts) and allow it to sit on the subframe.
Unhook the oil level sensor on the front of the oil pan. If you can't see how..use a wrench to loosen the sensor a little.
turn the flexplate either by the crank bolt or with a screwdriver at the flex to remove the 3 18mm flex to converter bolts
This almost concludes the underneath work

From up top,
Remove accordian tube, disconnect IAT and air box cover that clips on.
unhook the TPS, MAF, IAC, EGR, coolant sensor, injectors, MAP sensor, alternator, main plug by FPR for the ICM/crank sensor etc (those stay on the motor with that small harness)
Unhook top radiator hose (usually at motor) and heater hoses.
Front lowest trand bolt should have the grounds connected to it. Remove the 15mm nut holding them onto the stud (if the stud starts to turn, it'* an 18mm and pain, but you would have to hold it)

Now double check that you got all the stuff unhooked.
Bring your hoist in to play (leveler is nice to have)
Put a little tension on the motor
In the passengerside wheel well, unbolt the engine mount from it'* rubber thingee. It'* about a 22/24mm
Lower the engine slightly on the passenger side
With tension off that mount, reach in and unbolt the 3 15mm bolts that hold the bracket/mount to the motor/oil pan. I might be off on the bolt size of the one up and to the left of the balancer..but it'* close.
With that bracket out of the way...stop thinking of it'* scrap value ...it'* a nice bracket that you need..lol Now you are done underneath.
Bring the engine back to about level and remove the 4 18mm bolts holding the trans to the engine. You can easily do this under the exhaust.
Split the motor from the trans and lift.

FWIW I don't take off hoods. i undo the supports and then support the hood further up. Saves on alignment.

Major differences between Dan'* write up and mine.
I don't take off the rear exhaust manifold, that'* what you do when you have headers. And you'd only take off the crossover if you had togs/WBS headers.
The mount at the passenger side can't be done until you are ready to pull the motor.
I listed the bolt sizes...yes, I've done too many.
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Old 03-12-2012, 04:33 PM   #5
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a very belated thanks for the post'*. spring break'*[three in collage,one in high school] and storms rolling through all the time ,have been busy!!! looking for motor now. any thought on used motor vs remanufactured?
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Old 03-12-2012, 05:17 PM   #6
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Check the local salvage yards to see if they have a low mileage engine. If so, it'* just a mater of pull the old and put in the new. Hook it up and your about done. If you find a engine from a older car, say a 97 or 98, you may need to swap a few sensors, but it'* still the same engine.
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Old 03-12-2012, 06:50 PM   #7
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Most yards offer a 30 day warranty. If you pull it at the beginning of the month and don't get it installed until 3 weeks later, you just lost 3/4 of your warranty. With a remanufactured engine, you get, what a year or so of warranty?

I, along with Danthurs and Billboost37, have changed out numerous engines over the years. With me, all of my engines have come from the junkyard.

1995-2005 is your year range blockwise. The newer, obviously the better.

I believe Autozone can sell you a short block. This consists of the engine block, crank, pistons and camshaft. You would then have to swap over everything else from the old engine. With this option, you have the ability of replacing ALL gaskets and have a better feeling knowing you have a good engine that should last many more miles.
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:14 PM   #8
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you must be a mind reader!! that'* my next question, where can I go to find the interchangability of the engines? I know the junkyard has a manual, but I have looked on graigslist, local papers ect. Is tere a web site out there for this and to let me know what I need from my engine.[oil pick up tube,harmonic balancer,oil pan ect,ect.] thanks again the KAPTAIN
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Old 03-13-2012, 06:31 PM   #9
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A 3800 series 2 (which is what you have) will fit any body style that it originally came with. If you were to grab one out of say a Grand Prix, leave ALL mounting brackets behind. Not compatible with your platform. That'* the easy part.

Once you have the engine, complete or not, you need to verify the sensors already on it. Or, you can remove ALL the sensors, and just transfer all of your over. It'* mainly a year thing when it comes to sensors. Some change over the years, some dont. But one thing to remember, the engine itself, 1995-2005, is the same no matter what. It'* the accessories on the outside of the engine is what matters. Brackets, sensors etc.
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Old 03-26-2012, 09:59 PM   #10
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Default found a motor!!

I found a 97 buick lesabre that has been rear ended and smashed in the front also. after looking at a lot of motors, I was able to hear this one run.60,000 miles, owned by two mechanics. nice!!! what will I need to do to put this buick motor in my 2000 bonny?
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