Starter Enable Relay - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


1992-1999 Series I L27 (1992-1994 SE,SLE, SSE) & Series II L36 (1995-1999 SE, SSE, SLE) and common problems for the Series I and II L67 (all supercharged models 92-99) Including Olds 88's, Olds LSS's and Buick Lesabres Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

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Old 01-15-2006, 06:34 PM   #11
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According to my link above, the resistor has to be within 5%, and you're well below that.

You did check the resistor before installing it, right?
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Old 01-15-2006, 07:02 PM   #12
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I'm scratching my head while typing this, but how do we know the resistance in the key side of the circuit is okay if it wasn't working to begin with when it was tested? All we are doing is substituting a faulty resistance reading with a known good resistor, but it could also be just as wrong.

We need to test the key side of the circuit when it is working - starting the car and keeping it running, right? Otherwise, we'll get a value that won't start the car. I'll look in my 93 FSM if someone hasn't beaten me to it.
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Old 01-15-2006, 07:20 PM   #13
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Yes I did check it and it measures 2.926 Kohms. The keys measure 2.998 Kohms. A difference of 72 ohms. Without the resistor the starter will not crank. With the resistor the engine cranks and runs for 1-2 seconds, then stalls. Pressing on the gas causes it to stall immediately. The security light flashes when I open the door. When the door is shut it goes out. Key in the ignition then crank and run security light comes on and stays on. When the key is removed security light goes out. I just hope that this is not a compound problem (ie 2 at once!!).
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Old 01-15-2006, 07:38 PM   #14
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The difference between those two readings per the FSM has to be 10 ohms or less. You are greater than that by my calculations. This is the first time I've read up on this, but according to FSM it says to replace ignition lock and keys. I'm sure someone knows a better way around this though.

Here'* the info.
Mearure R from ignition lock side terminal E13 to ground and then E12 to ground. Is Resistance 10ohms or less? this should be no to proceed with testing - or replace lock and keys

Reconnect connector
Measure R Across Key pellet and record. Put key into lock. Disconnect Decoder module connector. Meaure R from module harness conn terminal B7 to B8. Is this R within 10ohms of the key pellet? if NO, check for poor connection and high resistance in crkt.
If yes, measure R with kiy in lock cylinder off postion. Decoder mod harness conn term B8 and B7 to ground. Is R 10 ohms or less?
Yes, repair short or repeat test
No, more testing

More testing
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Old 01-15-2006, 07:45 PM   #15
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Chk ckt 803 for an open or high R
Check decoder module conn
Is ground wiring ckt 803 and termin cont in good condition?
Yest
Reconnect deocder module conn.
Try to start engine Start?
yes
Check conn C202 for intermit contacts


That'* the end unless it stops starting all together. Since the wiring contacts are likely ok, I'd say the problem could be the wear item, esp with that many miles - key lock cylinder.
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Old 01-15-2006, 08:35 PM   #16
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Over the last few years I have had problems with this. Put key in and security light comes on, no crank. Wait 3 minutes cranks. Mild inconvenience, I got past it.

A few months ago this exact thing happend (no crank whatsoever). I started diagnosing it over the next day and by fiddling with it for a few hours it suddenly started and worked fine except that the security light stayed on permenantly. I have the trunk lock cylinder removed (including the wires for the anti-tamper) so I thought that would have caused the security light to stay on, don't know?

After changing the oil this happen again, no crank. I measured the output from the key cylinder and it was open. (I have been having problems with the steering column, the tilt is loose). So I can safely assume that one of the small wires is broken. I got the resistor from a car stereo shop, cut the wires from the key cylinder and wired it in. The car now will crank over, starts then stalls.

Looking at my wiring diagrams I see that there is 5v reference coming from the Decoder Module to the Ignition cylinder. This 5 volts goes through the pellet, back into the module and to ground.

I am thinking that if there is an open in the cylinder circuit then the 5v does not get back to the module and the starter enable relay is not actuated. If there is an incorrect voltage (ie incorrect resistor or dirty keys/contacts) then the start circuit will enable but then shut down. The FSM and Mitchells does state the resistance must be within 10 ohms. Others say it just has to be within 5%. Has anyone actually tested this?

Can someone confirm for me what the security light should do when the cylinder is put to run (no crank).

Cheers
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Old 01-15-2006, 08:48 PM   #17
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Throughout years on installing remote starters, the 5% rule has always worked well for me. When I swapped the motor in my 90 I had to install the VATS module. It would start and the stall after running for only 3 seconds or so. The problem was that the PCM wasn't getting the Pulse Width Modulated signal cause it wasn't properly grounded. It is odd that you can crank the engine because the VATS module disables both crank and PWM signals at the same time when an incorrect or out of range resistance is seen.
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Old 01-15-2006, 10:06 PM   #18
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Off hand, do you know where the PCM ground is located? I am willing to try anything right now. I think this is may indeed be a multiple problem here happening at the same time!
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Old 01-16-2006, 12:04 AM   #19
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PCM ground should be the one under the coil pack bracket
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Old 01-16-2006, 06:55 AM   #20
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And what does the security light do when you get into the car. I know the security light flashes while the door is open. I shut the door and the light goes out. I insert the key into the ignition and go to run (not crank). The light then comes on solid. I seem to recall that the light would go out after a few seconds. It is not now. I crank, it starts for 2-3 seconds then stalls. The security light stays on. If someone could confirm that that this is not operating properly I will know that to focus my energies on the PASS-Key system (possibly the module).
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