sudden death of a 90 LE - Page 3 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


1987-1991 Parley with regards to your 1987 to 1991 Bonneville, Olds 88 or Buick Le Sabre Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

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Old 03-01-2005, 02:59 PM   #21
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First thing to try is to r&r the ignition module connector making sure it seats firmly

To really troubleshoot, start by downloading the "Cranks But Does Not Run" .pdf from my web page (small excerpt from the service manual).
http://bellsouthpwp.net/p/a/padgett46/cbdnr.pdf

Note the "priming" reference - you can stimulate this buy jumpering 12v to harness connector "D" and should hear (or see if you have a test light) the injectors rattle. If they do, the ECM is probably good.

What I am hearing sounds like a failing ICM (Ignition control module - under the coilpack). Ior possibly a bad crank sensor (but when the CS fails it is usually never to run again). Running for a while (until it starts warming up) sounds like an ICM. I usually check by swapping but then I keep a spare ignition/coil module around - is a 10 minute swap.

90 has the Magnavox ignition. I upgraded ours to a 92 Delco ignition and a complete good "experienced" system (plate, coils, ICM) should cost about half of what a new ICM goes for. Again a 10 minute swap infact you can go back and forth as long as you have the complete system.
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Old 03-01-2005, 09:31 PM   #22
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99% guarantee that its the crank sensor.
to replace the 30 dollar part, take off the balancer. which means removing the belt and flywheel guard. then clamp onto the flywheel with a pair of visegrips. Take a breaker bar and break the crank nut off. this part sucks. once you have that off, remove the two bolts holding on the sensor bracket. now you'll probably have to break the bracket to get it off because theres a pin that will sieze onto the bracket over time. with that off, put your new crank sensor assembly on ... bolt it up. Leave the sensor loose in the bracket though. carefully slide the balancer back in place. tighten the bolt to 219 ft lbs. now comes the part where i screwed up. take a gapper with .020 and stick it between the inner balancer ring and one of the magnets of the sensor. Have someone push on the sensor and leave the gapper in place to ensure proper positioning. Tighten the bracket bolt to i believe its 33 in. lbs.
Thats it.

Have fun.
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Old 03-02-2005, 12:47 AM   #23
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but the crank sensor doesnt throw a code, unless you think it was just picking up that the engine has died? what part does the MAF sensor play in the mix anyway? maybe?
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Old 03-02-2005, 07:42 AM   #24
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You know what.. rjolly is right. I remember when my car used to have some Transmission related stalling, the SES light would come on right after the engine stalled. But it always gave me a code 12 [just checking to make sure it wasn't an acutal code]. I betcha the SES light is just there to say "Hey man.. your uhh engine stopped running here, you may want to restart it." But in ECM terms, that would be "01001000 01100101 01111001 00100000 01101101 01100001 01101110 00101110 00101110 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 01110010 00100000 01110101 01101000 01101000 00100000 01100101 01101110 01100111 01101001 01101110 01100101 00100000 01110011 01110100 01101111 01110000 01110000 01100101 01100100 00100000 01110010 01110101 01101110 01101110 01101001 01101110 01100111 00100000 01101000 01100101 01110010 01100101 00101100 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 00100000 01101101 01100001 01111001 00100000 01110111 01100001 01101110 01110100 00100000 01110100 01101111 00100000 01110010 01100101 01110011 01110100 01100001 01110010 01110100 00100000 01101001 01110100" And yes, that is correct Binary Code. I cheated on this one, I didn't feel like converting all that myself. [it'* early and I am lazy].


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Old 03-02-2005, 04:09 PM   #25
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I never saw a GM ECM use ASCII before.
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Old 03-02-2005, 05:40 PM   #26
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Okay, if you want to get smart, our ECU'* use Hex, not Binary. But, the general consensus is that Computer = Binary.


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Old 03-02-2005, 09:57 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 89bonnevil
99% guarantee that its the crank sensor.
to replace the 30 dollar part, take off the balancer. which means removing the belt and flywheel guard. then clamp onto the flywheel with a pair of visegrips. Take a breaker bar and break the crank nut off. this part sucks. once you have that off, remove the two bolts holding on the sensor bracket. now you'll probably have to break the bracket to get it off because theres a pin that will sieze onto the bracket over time. with that off, put your new crank sensor assembly on ... bolt it up. Leave the sensor loose in the bracket though. carefully slide the balancer back in place. tighten the bolt to 219 ft lbs. now comes the part where i screwed up. take a gapper with .020 and stick it between the inner balancer ring and one of the magnets of the sensor. Have someone push on the sensor and leave the gapper in place to ensure proper positioning. Tighten the bracket bolt to i believe its 33 in. lbs.
Thats it.

Have fun.
Do you know what size the crank nut is? I've got to but a few tools to do this job. I'm at school in AZ, and about 99% of my tools are home in OH. 219ft lbs=tight as hell
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Old 03-02-2005, 10:09 PM   #28
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Actually removals are easy (see previous posts), it is putting back that is difficult. Believe the factory bolt takes a 15/16" socket but aftermarket may be 1 1/8" (trust nothing from my memory but were recent posts). Yes Virginia, the bolt heads are SAE and not metric.

BTW them'* "1"* and "0" were ASCII characters expressed in binary. Hex is just a shortcut. I converted direct
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Old 03-02-2005, 10:37 PM   #29
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Heh, good. Metric scares me. well not scares me so much as annoys me. I needed some of both matric and sae to change the waterpump. Stupid half and half vehicle.
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Old 03-04-2005, 09:39 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theprodigalstranger
Stupid half and half vehicle.
Well, since we're this far "Off Topic" I'll go off the deep end here.

That'* what you get when your "Elected Officials" builds your car. The Metric Conversion Act of 1975 was a wishy-washy attempt to convert the US to the Metric System. It was purely voluntary. It turns out to be a real "mess". We still by soda in 12oz cans, but also in 2 liter plastic bottles. I think the big winner here was Sears Craftsman(and the other tool makers). We had to buy 2 sets of wrenches/sockets to work on our "Domestic" Cars.
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