my 87 lives on + control arm question - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


1987-1991 Parley with regards to your 1987 to 1991 Bonneville, Olds 88 or Buick Le Sabre Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-25-2007, 10:24 PM   #11
Executed
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Purgatory
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
MikeDiaz is on a distinguished road
Default

Thanks to all for the posts / info. Especially to Bill Buttermore up there for his great tips on removing the old arms.

Friday I got in there and squired PB Blaster on the control arm bolts' nuts and gave them a few many good hammer whacks. Then a little while later, repeated, then even later, repeated again.

Saturday I went in there and repeated process one last time just before going at it with my wrenches and breaker bar. To my surprise it was NO PRoblem at all to get them loose.

So I got the old one off and the new one is in place (bolts not tightened).
I'm saving that for next time, but I think I may as well replace my halfshaft while I've got the arm disconnected from the steering knuckle.

Any tips on half shaft replacement? Looks pretty straight forward except maybe for how to tell when its been 'tapped' into the transmission all the way. Do I really need to take off the brake rotor for it? I don't see why i would but the FSM says so.


Last question -- I'm supposed to have the control arm supporting the car'* weight when I tighten its bolts. How do i do this?
--I believe it'* (and correct me if I'm wrong):
Loosely attach the bolts and nuts to hold the control arm in place. Loosely install the control arm to steering knuckle via the ball joint.
use a jack under the control arm to raise the vehicle until the vehicle raises slightly (meaning the control arm is supporting the weight---this may take a lot of motion because the spring will compress a lot before the car actually begins to raise.

Tighten the control arm'* bolts to spec.
tighten the ball joint to spec.



Sound right??
Thanks again!!
Mike
MikeDiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2007, 01:01 AM   #12
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Ames, Iowa
Posts: 3,066
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
bill buttermore is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeDiaz
Any tips on half shaft replacement? Looks pretty straight forward except maybe for how to tell when its been 'tapped' into the transmission all the way. Do I really need to take off the brake rotor for it? I don't see why i would but the FSM says so.
I don't think you need to take off the rotor. But I like to undo the brake line clamp to allow me to pull the strut with the knuckle back and wire it to some convenient place to get the straightest possible shot at snapping the halfshaft back into the trans. It helps to pull the shaft out enough that there is not pressure on the circlip before you do the quick push inward. It is the momentum that helps compress the clip more than the inward force. Sometimes when I can't get the circlip to pop into the trans, I pull the strut and the hub out and install the outer end of the halfshaft through the hub with the inner end up to the snap ring. Then, sitting on the ground with a foot on either side of the rotor, pull the shaft out maybe a 1/2 '' and then give a sharp push with my legs to pop the shaft in. You can also try a quick lever action on the outer end of the inner tripot joint with a tire iron or tap it in with a long sledge hammer handle drift (30" piece of 1-/1/4" hickory) against the tripot joint and a 4 or 6 pound sledge. You will know when it pops in.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeDiaz
Last question -- I'm supposed to have the control arm supporting the car'* weight when I tighten its bolts. How do i do this?
--I believe it'* (and correct me if I'm wrong):
Loosely attach the bolts and nuts to hold the control arm in place. Loosely install the control arm to steering knuckle via the ball joint.
use a jack under the control arm to raise the vehicle until the vehicle raises slightly (meaning the control arm is supporting the weight---this may take a lot of motion because the spring will compress a lot before the car actually begins to raise.

Tighten the control arm'* bolts to spec.
tighten the ball joint to spec.



Sound right??
Thanks again!!
Mike
Nice instructions if you have a ramp lift in a GM garage. I think the reason for tightening the control arm to frame with weight is to set the lower arm in the mid-position of its range of motion so that the rubber bushings are not over-flexed. Also, if the control arm is set too high, it makes it difficult to push it down far enough to slip the ball joint post into the knuckle. I would think you could just observe the angle of a control arm in place with the car sitting normally and eyeball the same angle as you install the new control arm. If you use the method you described, I would tighten that ball joint (with the drive axle installed) to spec before jacking it, and be careful to make sure the front subframe had good support under it in case the jack slips. I would be uneasy applying big torque to those control arm to frame bolts with the weight supported by a jack.
bill buttermore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2007, 06:04 PM   #13
Executed
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Purgatory
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
MikeDiaz is on a distinguished road
Default

Got myself a halfshaft today from the parts place.

I'm about to go run and get a hubnut socket and hopefully a puller to separate the shaft from the hub. Tips for pushing the shaft from the hub would be appreciated!


Havin' fun!
mike
MikeDiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2007, 07:18 PM   #14
Executed
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Purgatory
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
MikeDiaz is on a distinguished road
Default

old halfshaft nearly slipped off on its own (from hub). no tool needed for that, just a few hammer taps.

i cant get the trans side of the shaft off easily. is there a clip to depress for removal? ill go take a closer look.

mike
MikeDiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2007, 09:42 PM   #15
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Ames, Iowa
Posts: 3,066
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
bill buttermore is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeDiaz
old halfshaft nearly slipped off on its own (from hub). no tool needed for that, just a few hammer taps.

i cant get the trans side of the shaft off easily. is there a clip to depress for removal? ill go take a closer look.

mike
There is a circlip (snap ring) that holds the inner shaft into a groove in the transaxle. You need to force the inner tripot housing out quickly with a little momentum to depress the circlip so that the shaft will come out. Do not pull on the shaft - the inner tripot joint may come apart if you do. The outward force must be on the inner, heavy part of the tripot (inner joint) housing.

On the passenger side, you can get a long, strong drift - like a sledge hammer handle - against the inside of the joint. Then, lying on the driver'* side with the drift as parallel to the shaft as you can manage, strike the drift with at least a 4-lb sledge. The outer part of the shaft must be free to move outward of course. I tie back the knuckle toward the rear of the car to make the way clear when I do 'em.

On the driver'* side, use a tire iron as a lever against the inner side of the tripot joint and slap the bottom of the iron sharply with your hand or a sledge to pop the shaft outward. The key is momentum, not force. Slide the shaft inward before striking it outward to give the circlip a better chance to compress.

BTW, there is a procedure written up for halfshaft removal in Techinfo. You might want to check that out.
bill buttermore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2007, 10:02 PM   #16
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Texarkana, Texas
Posts: 6,041
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Damemorder is on a distinguished road
Default

Entirly off topic, But if you need parts my old '87 is still in the junkyard. 280K of arkansas/Texas on it.
Damemorder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2007, 11:18 PM   #17
Executed
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Purgatory
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
MikeDiaz is on a distinguished road
Default

thanks for the tips.

and thanks for the offer for parts, i'll keep it in mind!

I got it off earlier today by using a rather large wrench (no particular size) and my pickle fork (tie rod seperator).

I saw some other articles on the internet about half shaft removal and all of them spoke of circle clip defeat being about using two tools to apply removal force so that you get it resulting in a uniform direction (pulling the shaft out).

This gave me the confidence that I didn't have to do anything extra with clips which had been keping me from applying full force on it.

Anyways, a solid good force application and i felt it come out a little, freeing it from the circle cliip. Pull out was easy.

I put the new one on, re-put on the ball joint to knuckle (not totally tight) and tiie rod end. Then I jacked up from under the ball joint enough to sort of get it to where it should sit at when the car is under just it'* own load (roughly with the control arm parallel to the rest of the underbody frame.

I started tightening the rear bolt to the specified torque. I didn't get to hear the clicking of the torque wrench but it was pretty tight, and i had applied a bit of lock tight.
I wanted to tighten more but the night fell on me and I couldn't see. Tomorrow morning I'll torque it to spec (although i'll have to beat the lock tight by then..) and then tighten the front bolt. Then I'll tighten the ball joint and put in its cotter pin.

And of course, tighten up the hub /half shaft nut.



At that point I should be able to at least start her up for the first time in months (got a whole little procedure for that too.. oil and plug related) and drive her around the block. She'* not much to look at due to age and paint peal but I love the car and will be very glad to see it on its feet... especially after everyone had told me to just get rid of her.

thanks for all the help and tips
mike
MikeDiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2007, 09:22 AM   #18
Executed
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Purgatory
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
MikeDiaz is on a distinguished road
Default

transmission oil started leaking out when I pulled the old halfshaft,

i'm talking verry slowly (halfshaft was off for about a half hour and total leakage was probably 3-5 table spoons.

I Just wantt o make sure that this is normal and not a sign of a broken seal or something I should have replaced.

mike
MikeDiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2007, 09:59 AM   #19
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Ames, Iowa
Posts: 3,066
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
bill buttermore is on a distinguished road
Default

Yes, that little bit of leakage is normal.
bill buttermore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2007, 03:45 PM   #20
Executed
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Purgatory
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
MikeDiaz is on a distinguished road
Default

Awesome, I thought so. I just got back from taking it around the block a few times!
Wanted to drive it more but it is unregistered with my other car'* tag and with a broken tail light lens... i.e. if a cop saw me I'd be pulled over and be beyond F'ed.

Haven't driven it since last June
And I thought I would never ride it again!!!!


I put ont the new half shafts and torqued everything to spec and rode it. THe passenger'* side i still have to do but, although the old ball joint job I did on it was as bad as the one on the driver'* side, the passenger'* ball joint is still in place - that'* why I was able to drive it. I'll have to replace its ball joint and half shaft in the next few weeks. Should be exact same procedure. I'm psyched.

Thanks to all for the help!!!!!!!!!
Mike

p.*. After driving mainnly my 95 trans am since last summer, I must say these 87 big cars are really great riding machines. Great visibility and they enjoy eating up the road!! I remember now whY i loved this car so much.
MikeDiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Replacing lower control arm on S10, torsion bar question GunsOfNavarone GMC/Chevrolet Truck/SUV 5 12-03-2014 09:46 AM
trailing arm/lateral arm jayd435 2000-2005 8 07-14-2013 12:25 PM
Control Arm question samb1987 2000-2005 1 08-14-2012 10:35 PM
Ball joints, tie rods, pitman arm, and idler arm StealthGXP Lounge 2 01-21-2011 09:42 AM
Question about lower control arm.... DarkShadow 1987-1991 8 11-17-2005 03:21 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:23 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.