Crankshaft Sensor goes along with performance (Long)
01-24-2004, 05:52 PM
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Crankshaft Sensor goes along with performance (Long)
During a cold snap here I had a hard time getting my car started, when I did, after several pretty good backfires and flames out the throttle body, it sounded like it was missing on 1 or more cylinders. I attributed it to the cold and shut it off.
Wouldn't start at all the next day so I took it to a guy with a SnapOn computer, and found that the crankshaft sensor was 'gone'. :o Keep in mind prior to this it ran AOK!
He replaced the CS Sensor. When I picked it up it sounded like it was running on 5 cylinders, missing, and NO power at all. It was all it could do to drive home. I also noticed there is quit a bit of valve train noise now, never was before.
I am going to check the spark plugs and feul injectors for possible clogging due to carbon during the backfires. Can a backfire bend or distort valve train parts? What do you suppose is going on?
Wouldn't start at all the next day so I took it to a guy with a SnapOn computer, and found that the crankshaft sensor was 'gone'. :o Keep in mind prior to this it ran AOK!
He replaced the CS Sensor. When I picked it up it sounded like it was running on 5 cylinders, missing, and NO power at all. It was all it could do to drive home. I also noticed there is quit a bit of valve train noise now, never was before.
I am going to check the spark plugs and feul injectors for possible clogging due to carbon during the backfires. Can a backfire bend or distort valve train parts? What do you suppose is going on?
01-24-2004, 08:49 PM
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Great response, thanks. I'll answer those questions...
I didn't know that about the crank sensor. The backfires were helped out by some starting fluid sprayed into the mouth of the TB, it was -12 F. I am going to pull the codes tonite, and see what they tell me. I can also take it over to my guy with the Snapon and get a read again. I'll ask him for the full scan I guess
I haven't checked the plugs yet because I am lazy... 
... but will do that soon. I did think that the next thing after all that is to replace the coilpack/ignition module (same thing, right?), then find another ECM 
and try that. I'll let you know what the blinky codes are... soon. Thanks again!
I didn't know that about the crank sensor. The backfires were helped out by some starting fluid sprayed into the mouth of the TB, it was -12 F. I am going to pull the codes tonite, and see what they tell me. I can also take it over to my guy with the Snapon and get a read again. I'll ask him for the full scan I guess
I haven't checked the plugs yet because I am lazy... ... but will do that soon. I did think that the next thing after all that is to replace the coilpack/ignition module (same thing, right?), then find another ECM and try that. I'll let you know what the blinky codes are... soon. Thanks again!
Originally Posted by jr's3800
First I want to tell you there is another issue going on here... The 3800 engines will run without the Cam sensor... The cam sensor is strictly a reference for the ECM for Cylinder # 1 top dead center... You have a 1 in 6 chance of the car running crappy, if that were to happen you could shut off the car and restart and chances are it will run ok as it will be running off of a fault program... But I have never seen it cause Backfires that bad, as the ECM will still have the use of the Crank sensor... I am also courious as to what code or codes were pulled from the ECM with the Snapon... I'm thinkinh you will want to check those plugs... If that doesn't solve the problem you will want to suspect the Ignition Control Module( ICM ) or the Engine Control Module ( Cars computer ) for failure... The last time I had backfiring through the intake I replaced the ICM and got nowhere... I replaced the ECM and that solved the problem... Funny though when my ECM failed I was getting codes, 41, 42 and 43 all at the same time... Also did this happen suddenly or has this been an ongoing problem... while the codes were pulled was a full scan performed on the car to make sure all of the sensors were functioning? Let us anything you can think of.. 
01-24-2004, 10:55 PM
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I had my crank sensor go on my 90 SSE and it would run fine but once it warmed up it would stall and woudln't start. Or if I kept it running it sounded like it was backfiring, they seem to be somewhat common on these engines and not that expensive to change at all.
01-25-2004, 03:47 PM
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The problem didn't start until :? After :? the crankshaft sensor was replaced with a new one!
Originally Posted by sse1990
I had my crank sensor go on my 90 SSE and it would run fine but once it warmed up it would stall and woudln't start. Or if I kept it running it sounded like it was backfiring, they seem to be somewhat common on these engines and not that expensive to change at all.
01-25-2004, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by jr's3800
Damn... I touught you were talking about the cam sensor... Somebody slapp me.. 
But a bad Crank sensor can and will cause all sorts of issues... Small question though... What brand of crank sensor was used on your car? Do let us know what the codes are when yo get the time to pull them..
But a bad Crank sensor can and will cause all sorts of issues... Small question though... What brand of crank sensor was used on your car? Do let us know what the codes are when yo get the time to pull them..
ONE BACK SLAP COMING UP...
01-25-2004, 04:19 PM
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I'm tired but just an idea. If it was decently warm then all of a sudden got cold moisture can form almost anywhere. Have you looked for cracks in your coil packs? Or checked resistance?
01-25-2004, 04:43 PM
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I just check the codes on KOEO tests and just 12-12-12... forever. No codes set. The Crankshaft sensor is from Neihoff (or maybe Borg-Warner), but most likely Neihoff, if that matters!?
I also have been looking for the other diagnostics for a '91 OBDII ECM, doesn't it have a piston balance test, or do you need a scanner for that??? IF so point me to it. If it needs a scanner it will have to wait for next week.
I am now going to check the spark plugs... I hope I find a clogged up or broken one...
I also have been looking for the other diagnostics for a '91 OBDII ECM, doesn't it have a piston balance test, or do you need a scanner for that??? IF so point me to it. If it needs a scanner it will have to wait for next week.
I am now going to check the spark plugs... I hope I find a clogged up or broken one...
Originally Posted by DrJay
I'm tired but just an idea. If it was decently warm then all of a sudden got cold moisture can form almost anywhere. Have you looked for cracks in your coil packs? Or checked resistance?
01-25-2004, 04:46 PM
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Uh, I forgot one more quesiton. Would the coil resistance check be from the top of the connector to ground showing low or no ohms, or from the connector tip to plus 12 showing no or low ohms? Somebody know of a paper written up on that?? 
Originally Posted by DrJay
I'm tired but just an idea. If it was decently warm then all of a sudden got cold moisture can form almost anywhere. Have you looked for cracks in your coil packs? Or checked resistance?
01-25-2004, 06:45 PM
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ahh here ya go: http://www.bonnevilleclub.com/techinfo/?article=33
BTW your 91 has an obd I computer, not obd II. He was probably asking what brand you used because our cars have a history of eating electronics from companies they don't like, especially bosch. Strange.
BTW your 91 has an obd I computer, not obd II. He was probably asking what brand you used because our cars have a history of eating electronics from companies they don't like, especially bosch. Strange.
