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1987-1991 Parley with regards to your 1987 to 1991 Bonneville, Olds 88 or Buick Le Sabre Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

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Old 06-05-2006, 01:04 AM   #11
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the irony is when I converted the interior- it stopped working the next day. WTF Beautiful 98 interior,
OK, this i GOTTA see!!!!

850? not bad. There are things to consider when converting to 134. The evap, and condensor should be changed, as 134 is not as effiecent as r12, and it takes more space for 134 to work as efficently.
R134 is a smaller molecule, so r-12 hoses need to be replaced with 134 hoses to avoid leakage through the hoses. At least you'll have cold. I won't. Well, i'd like to get it working, but i live in canada. (tougher regulations) and i want to do it the proper way, not the backyard filling it with propane. and risk contaminating the system of air, lol.
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Old 06-05-2006, 04:33 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Timothy'* Buick
Quote:
the irony is when I converted the interior- it stopped working the next day. WTF Beautiful 98 interior,
OK, this i GOTTA see!!!!

850? not bad. There are things to consider when converting to 134. The evap, and condensor should be changed, as 134 is not as effiecent as r12, and it takes more space for 134 to work as efficently.
R134 is a smaller molecule, so r-12 hoses need to be replaced with 134 hoses to avoid leakage through the hoses. At least you'll have cold. I won't. Well, i'd like to get it working, but i live in canada. (tougher regulations) and i want to do it the proper way, not the backyard filling it with propane. and risk contaminating the system of air, lol.
Tim- I live north of Toronto-

R-12 is evil Very bad for the ozone layer.
But I will be replacing everything, because as you said the two gases are different, and R-12 is colder then R134A. My Evap and condencer had many holes in them- they filled the system with nitrogen, and it leaked everywhere. Compressor is shot too. It burned up two summers ago, and has been bypassed ever since. I've done so much work to this car, I couldn't pass up the opportunity, and with a whole new system, I figured I couldn't go wrong
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Old 06-05-2006, 09:13 PM   #13
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My 89 still has an r-12 system that works fine and is ice cold. If I were to change it over what all needs changed. Is it just a flush and recharge with the r-134a ir are there components that need changed also.
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Old 06-06-2006, 12:28 AM   #14
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What'* suprising is they will take the time to do a total retrofit, and replace everything for that price! Some shops absolutly will not touch an older R-12 system, (liability issues i guess?)

I may do a brand new replacement of everything in my car, then have a shop leak test, and charge with 134. This will come only after I finish everything else in the car, (paint, rims, etc)

I have thought about using the so-called refrigerants that have butane/isobutane(?), in my current system. I know its flammable, but those types of gasses are extremely efficent, and should send ice chunks through the vents, lol. But I'd have to do this properly, and that means purging the system of air, (nitrogen) obtaining a set of manifold gauges(?), checking for leaks, using the right oil, etc. Its alot of work, and involves replacing the drier, and filter, orifice, and several o-rings, amongst other things. I'd do this to keep the compressor from failing, and its also a cheap way to go, lol.
Would sure be nice if the shop i work at was equipped with A/C capabilites, (nice discount), lol.
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Old 06-06-2006, 01:12 AM   #15
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I have had a couple of cars converted over to the R-134a, and am about to have my new grey 90 SSE converted. In the first couple of cars, it was just a matter of changing a couple fittings to allow the car to hook up to the r134a machine, on top of draining the system and making sure all the r-12 is out. They then replace it with the r134-a and use the proper oil. On one car I had to replace the hoses cause they were rotten and were finished.

I did not have to change any other components for the conversion ( except the broken pieces).
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Old 06-06-2006, 02:12 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myfirstbonnie
My 89 still has an r-12 system that works fine and is ice cold. If I were to change it over what all needs changed. Is it just a flush and recharge with the r-134a ir are there components that need changed also.
Matt- If its still good- than wait until it stops working. Im not 100% sure of what exactly differs between the two types of systems. I actually know very little about it- still in my learning stages!!
PS Emblem still look good?

Tim: Benefits of knowing my buddy since I was 5. Who knew that he would become a GM mechanic!

Mike : does theair still work in the newbie?

Unfortunatly- Im playing the waiting game or maybe I should say the sweating game. Parts have been ordered, but I have yet to hear back when they are actually being installed on the car. soon I hope.
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Old 06-06-2006, 09:15 AM   #17
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No the one in the new car doesn't work, that is why it is going in, getting converted, then checking to see what parts I need to steal ( if I can) from the white car to get it working on the grey car.
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Old 06-06-2006, 02:17 PM   #18
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Default R-12

Now is R-12 really bad or is it just what we have been led to believe by politics? My study of R-12 finds that it'* heavier than air and disapates in the dirt when it falls to the ground.......so how does it get 250,000 miles up? If exhaust on hot days creates ozone and R-12 depletes it....it would appear that it'* a zero sum gain. How nice when the Dupont patent was about to expire we find that R-12 is harmful.....now we have a new chemical that has a 75 year patent on by Dupont. Just kinda curious.

Find more info in the books by the former Atomic Energy Commision chairperson....Dr. Dixie Lee Ray------" Environmental Overkill: Whatever Happened to Common Sense?" and "Trashing the Planet: How Science Can Help Us Deal With Acid Rain, Depletion of the Ozone, and Nuclear Waste (Among Other Things)".
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Old 06-06-2006, 02:19 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dandyd
Now is R-12 really bad or is it just what we have been led to believe by politics? My study of R-12 finds that it'* heavier than air and disapates in the dirt when it falls to the ground.......so how does it get 250,000 miles up? If exhaust on hot days creates ozone and R-12 depletes it....it would appear that it'* a zero sum gain. How nice when the Dupont patent was about to expire we find that R-12 is harmful.....now we have a new chemical that has a 75 year patent on by Dupont. Just kinda curious.

Find more info in the books by the former Atomic Energy Commision chairperson....Dr. Dixie Lee Ray------" Environmental Overkill: Whatever Happened to Common Sense?" and "Trashing the Planet: How Science Can Help Us Deal With Acid Rain, Depletion of the Ozone, and Nuclear Waste (Among Other Things)".
Hmm. Interesting take. Anything is possible......

Mike: Nice to have a doner car- frame is still hanging in there on the white one?
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Old 06-06-2006, 08:41 PM   #20
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Yeah, the frame is still hanging in there. The car died on my the other day. At first I thought it was a dirty fuel filter, but it seems more like an electrical issue. I am not too concerned though, since we have 2 other cars plus the white one.
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