Whats your estimate? - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning Talk about modifications, or anything else associated with performance enhancements. Have a new idea for performance/reliability? Post it here. No idea is stupid! (please use Detailing and Appearance for cosmetic ideas)

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-28-2004, 03:42 PM   #11
Junior Member
Posts like a Ricer Type-R
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
willwren is on a distinguished road
Default

A high-flow Cat will flow the same as a straight pipe in that application. My oversized CAT is invisible to the car. It flows BETTER than a 2.5" pipe. I got a cat with 3" inlet and outlet for that reason, and had adapters welded on for it.
willwren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2004, 10:23 PM   #12
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

i would say he is in the ballpark at the crank. he already has 36# injectors stock, and if it is a custom ecu, that along will greatly increase the HP by advancing timing and changing the A/F ratios.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2004, 10:59 PM   #13
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
GAMEOVER's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Racine Wi
Posts: 5,146
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
GAMEOVER is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Whats your estimate?

Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
-Magnuson Supercharger Nose drive assembally NO GAIN
-Good-year Gator-back belt NO GAIN
-Catalytic converter removed NO GAIN (maybe 5 tops)
-Replaced with a off-road pipe/O2 simulator NO GAIN
-Borla dual 2" round pipes NO GAIN
-After market ECU WHAT ECU?
-ACDelco Platinum plugs NO GAIN
-Accel 8.5mm Performance plug wires NO GAIN


I agree, the other mods might make 300 hp at the crank, but not the wheels.

why do people buy these if they dont make a difference?
for instance you have plugs and wires??
just asking
GAMEOVER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2004, 11:02 PM   #14
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

it is done for 2 reasons, style and dependablity.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2004, 11:07 PM   #15
Junior Member
Posts like a Ricer Type-R
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
willwren is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Whats your estimate?

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe
Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
-Magnuson Supercharger Nose drive assembally NO GAIN
-Good-year Gator-back belt NO GAIN
-Catalytic converter removed NO GAIN (maybe 5 tops)
-Replaced with a off-road pipe/O2 simulator NO GAIN
-Borla dual 2" round pipes NO GAIN
-After market ECU WHAT ECU?
-ACDelco Platinum plugs NO GAIN
-Accel 8.5mm Performance plug wires NO GAIN


I agree, the other mods might make 300 hp at the crank, but not the wheels.

why do people buy these if they dont make a difference?
for instance you have plugs and wires??
just asking
Magnusson nose drive is an OEM replacment. He must have fried his.
Gatorback belt prevents slipping with a smaller SC pulley.
Borla tips? Looks and sound.
Plugs and wires are a tuneup item. Ever replaced yours? With hotter coils, a good performance wire CAN be a small power-adder.
willwren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2004, 12:08 AM   #16
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
GAMEOVER's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Racine Wi
Posts: 5,146
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
GAMEOVER is on a distinguished road
Default

my personal opinion is all those small things add up in the end
GAMEOVER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2004, 12:12 AM   #17
Junior Member
Posts like a Ricer Type-R
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
willwren is on a distinguished road
Default

How is a replacement nosedrive, a pair of Borla tips, and a belt going to 'add up' to horsepower?
willwren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2004, 04:02 PM   #18
Senior Member
Certified GM nut
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Georgia
Posts: 2,095
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
DrJay is on a distinguished road
Default

I'm not the best on guesstimating HP but I'll try and give you a little food for thought, if its worth anything...

12 things maybe 5 actually make HP. Unless your plug wires are old you won't get a gain from replacing them no matter how big you go. Larger wires are offered to accomidate a hotter ignition system which will allow you to enlarge your plug gap which coupled with more air and fuel will give you power. But wires on their own won't because its part of a whole system. The Magnuson Nose Drive has been looked at before (personally) and it is a stock replacement, it offers a performance gain if you order the optional smaller pulley which it seems as though he has. But thats really just an expensive pulley replacement, unless it was failing him to begin with (somewhat rare) he spent money for nothing. The gator back belts are zilch on the HP gain, not even coupled with the other things. Some may argue that it adds "traction" to the supercharger pulley allowing it to spin better. Something you have to remember is that company estimates on HP gain are not only useless but if they are anywhere near accurate they were done in lab type conditions with every variable taken care of. In other words when they were testing the pulley they would have made sure to use the proper belt size and tension anyway. It would be like claiming a big HP gain (over stock) by replacing your 100,000mile plug wires. You MAY see a gain (0.1-1hp), but you're just getting back what you paid for anyway. Of course the o2 simulator (and pipe) is only so he doesn't get an error message about his cat not being there, another no-hp modification. Platinum plugs are only for durability and offer no HP gain. The only gains possible from plugs are the somewhat controversial plug indexing and making a larger gap coupled with more air and fuel but then most of that gain would be by the added fuel and air anyway, its only common sense that you need to be able to burn it all which our coils don't seem to have a problem with anyway seeing as some are running 11'* down the track with stock ignition. What does he have? A smaller pulley, an exhaust, and a CAI. That ECU makes me wonder but the gains could vary wildly from setup to setup so I can't guesstimate on it. Unless his CAI is insulated from the under hood temps he may very well be negating most of the gains he paid for. You always want a cooler intake charge, common knowledge, and a smaller pulley adds heat because the more you compress the air the hotter it gets. Its been estimated that 1psi adds 10deg to the charge. If he goes from 7-8psi to 10-11psi thats going from winter to summer driving performance. Ever notice you're a little quicker when its cold out? Add to that the hot exhaust air he'* pulling in while he sits there staging for the run or stopped at a red light. Remember, all company estimates are done by taking out all possible variables that would negatively effect the outcome. So I think its safe to assume that the 10-20hp you read about from a CAI is when its actually pulling cold air, same would go for the pulley. So there'* my thoughts on the matter.
DrJay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2004, 04:18 PM   #19
Senior Member
Posts like a Northstar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Buffalo Grove, IL
Posts: 666
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Glasuan is on a distinguished road
Default

Wow that was quite a read Dr. Jay. I will have to agree with most of your points. Only thing would be the CAI. Because he is running a smaller pulley, he needs more air. The supercharger demands it. Therefore I do not believe he is negating very much, even with the air being hotter. Quite a few of us here run open-cone filters, and if it is far enough away, its not much of a problem. But I will agree his air charge will be warmer.
Glasuan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2004, 08:10 PM   #20
Senior Member
True Car Nut
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Holt, MI & Lima, OH
Posts: 3,022
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
dbtk2 is on a distinguished road
Default

Well, my first question is why does the guy claim 330hp??? Does he have a dyno sheet and he based the number off of the wheel horsepower, or is he just adding everything up and guessing?

And that 330hp may not be as far off as you are thinking. I don't think it is accurate, but it could easily be within 10hp of that.


The K&N filter has virtually no gain. Especially since it is an open cone, meaning it is sucking in hot air from the engine bay. It makes a nice improvement in intake sound though. The snout, like willwren said, probably a replacement. A gatorback belt just helps the belt not slip. The tips, obviously an appearance item. The plugs are probably to help reduce KR. The wires just look good and make plug changes easier.

Now for the mods that probably did something:

-3.25" Supercharger pulley
-TOG Headers
-Borla Cat-bac exhaust
-Catalytic converter removed
-Replaced with a off-road pipe/O2 simulator
-After market ECU

The headers on a completely stock GTP add 18whp & 16wtq. Thats 22.5hp & 20lb.ft at the crank. Bringing our total power at this point up to 262.5hp.

Borla Exhaust, according to borla adds 12hp to a stock GTP. Now we are up to 274.5hp.

The offroad pipe has proven 8whp on a stock GTP. (it gets rid of the u-bend, cat, & downpipe). This is 10hp at the crank. Bringing the total now up to 284.5hp.

Now we have the pulley. Assuming he has all KR problems solved, the 3.25" pulley should add 30+hp or so. This brings our total up to 314.5hp.

If the aftermarket ECU is a DHP, because of the fuel table, timing tables, and KR changes in the PCM, it can add 10hp or MORE in some applications. So lets say it only added 5hp in his application, that still brings him to approx. 320hp.

Wow, this number is suprisingly close to his guess. Now you take all of those exhaust mods and their gain on a stock GTP running 4-5lbs. LESS boost than this guy, and their gains should be higher because of the need for increased exhaust flow.

So really, the guy could be making 330hp. I am just curious as to how he came up with that number.

Shawn
dbtk2 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Estimate usage out of a Intake Twister97 1992-1999 18 03-02-2004 08:27 PM
estimate paint cost Custom88 General GM Chat 12 02-18-2004 10:26 PM
LETS ESTIMATE GAMEOVER Lounge 19 02-09-2004 02:36 PM
92SSE failed emissions inspection---need estimate online wysteriamo 1992-1999 4 02-01-2003 06:37 AM
Car price estimate Sol 1992-1999 4 12-13-2002 09:20 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:18 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.