'That'* backwards depending on what you're looking at, head or header.'
-I have no idea what your talking about
series 2 heads and manifolds have same length exhaust ports and manifold primaries(for lack of a better word) and the valves go intake exhaust intake exhaust intake exhaust.
Series 1 heads have the center exhuast port off set and the primary on the manifold offset as well. I'm not sure about the valves though
'The series II is nice for modding because there'* an american market thanks to GP'*.'
I have no idea how this fits into this thread but ok................................................ ....

I think hes talking about the aussies being the only ones making S1 parts.

Valves too

oh wait ur right... Brain fart.

Yeah i'm whining about lack of parts.

Haha well parts are provided, but nobody wants to buy them. When I was searching for parts I would get responses like "no, there is no market for those parts" or "no, there is currently not enough demand." I always thought "yeah right, they just don't know." But no, they were right. The rockers 'sat on the shelf' for 4 months before I said "buy now or lose out" and managed to squeeze 4 buyers out of a group of some-odd thousand (who still haven't purchased them). The $240 cams are still sitting around, with next to 0 demand. The stroker crank, I doubt that'll ever move. Forged pistons? Nah. Rods? No way. I actually found the ATI Damper they sell on Intense Racing for about 50% of the cost, but that'll never sell.

In March I'm getting a set of headers done up. I'm going to have the whole process recorded with sizes of pipes, angles; a blueprint made. That way anyone can take it to a welder and pay a fraction of the price to have them thrown together. Although I doubt anyone will actually do it...

Its not a lack of parts.

------- End of rant

I Totally understand what your saying. but it'* all about the dollars. I doubt people have been saving up in hopes to spend it on some un discovered part for thier car. Now all these parts are uncovered, people have something to start saving up for and something to look forward to.
You and bonevilssei are pionering the **** out of the sereis one'* and i don't think people were ready for it.(mentally and financially)
I'm sure once these new mods are installed a bunch of people are gonna have p-envy and the demand will increase.
Still though i understand your point of view.

I can't justify $400+ for a setup that will get me 5-10HP at most. a 1:0.12 increase in rocker ratio isn't much in my opinion, and for $400 i'd do many other custom things before these rockers. 4 people on a deal like this isn't a market. There aren't 3000 active members here at all, heck many of those users have a whopping 0 posts.

So true BonneMeMN.

Thats all fine and dandy but my issue is with peoples statements. The rockers are cheaper, the cams are cheaper, I haven't priced the SII yet but I'm willing to bet the stroker crank is cheaper, headers are in a few months, porting can be done anywhere, smaller pulleys are available, forged pistons are available, forged rods are available, the ATI damper is available for cheaper...yet still "waah, no parts for Series I." Thats what I was going on. Its not so much "here they are, now buy them!" but I don't see the sense in bitching about imaginary parts that aren't available when you aren't buying the fairly priced ones that are. The fact is with the parts available you could be running 12'* for very nearly the same cost as a SII.

The rockers are, if you really look at it, not a bad deal. Intense sells their 1.9 rockers for $399.99, lets say $400. "We highly recommend the use of LS6 Medium Load Valvesprings with 1.90:1 ratio INTENSE™ Full Roller Rocker Arms" so we add in another $99.99 for those, lets say $100. I imagine most would want to replace their valve locks while they're doing this. There'* another $24.99, say $25. Splurge on added safety and get the spring retainers, that'll run you another $40. So if you go by the book its actually: $390 for say 10-15hp, or $565 for 20-25hp. Or $525 if you're "saving" and don't get the retainers. A difference of up to $175, depending on your options. Take that $175 savings, add in another $65, get one of the cams, and you'll seriously rock the hell out of the SII putting along with just rockers.

I dunno, its not a "holy hell, sell the farm we're getting these!" kind of deal...but it surely isn't bad. JMO though

Yeah people have backed out from their early statements, and I know what you mean completely, and agree with it. personally i'd be doing the whole valvetrain if I did rockers, so it would be more then $400 there as well.