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Old 01-25-2007, 07:34 PM   #1
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Default Question about shift speed and RPMs for your Bonneville,

Well, Ben'* Bonneville actually,

Please, anyone that has a 3:69 to 3:73 gear with a 1.112 final drive please suggest the following for Ben'* car.

Ben has an L36 with a 4T60-E with a 2800 stall TC and I need rough estimates:

Recommended RPM rev limiter for spark control?
I will also use this as a reference for the fuel cut-off RPM.

Recommended RPM for 1>2 & 2>3 shift?
If O don't get a good rough estimate Ben and I will simply drive the car, bounce the rev limiter and make it up, I was just hopeful to save some time.

Recommended WOT PRM for 1>2 & 2>3 shift?
Same as above comment, just looking for reference date.
Thanks,

Any other items for Mr. Ben?
I'm already setting the MPH limiter to 175 mph.
Fan turn-on temps for stage 1 & 2 will be related to the t-stat temp range.
Speedo calibration.
look into STFT & LTFT'*.
Clean MAF sensor then Cal MAF / AF ratio.
TCC duty cycle.
Maybe shift timings.
If he has the parameters, maybe I'll talk him into installing the perf shift button, or at least a switch to the same effect.
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Old 01-25-2007, 07:39 PM   #2
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Thomas, you're not likely to find any setup here remotely close to that retar.....umm...unique piece of machinery.

You're likely to get alot of opinions here, but in all honesty, 3800pro or (god forbid) CGP may net better results.
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Old 01-25-2007, 07:41 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
Thomas, you're not likely to find any setup here remotely close to that retar.....umm...unique piece of machinery.

You're likely to get alot of opinions here, but in all honesty, 3800pro or (god forbid) CGP may net better results.
Thanks, in that case, we'll just burn his gas and do it from scratch.. No problem.
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Old 01-25-2007, 08:32 PM   #4
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pmed with my thoughts...
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Old 01-25-2007, 08:35 PM   #5
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Default Re: Question about shift speed and RPMs for your Bonneville,

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXGTP
Please, anyone that has a 3:69 to 3:73 gear with a 1.112 final drive please suggest the following for Ben'* car.
The 1.12 you're referring to would be the stock Drive_Sprocket_Ratio. Was his gear and chainset changed to equate to a 3.69 set? 1.12 would be for the stock 3.06 I guess, then 1 for the 3.29 and likely .84 for the 3.69s.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXGTP
Recommended RPM rev limiter for spark control?
I will also use this as a reference for the fuel cut-off RPM.
That'* up to Ben, but anything past 6250 rpm on the street seems a little much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXGTP
Recommended RPM for 1>2 & 2>3 shift?
If O don't get a good rough estimate Ben and I will simply drive the car, bounce the rev limiter and make it up, I was just hopeful to save some time.
Don't forget to set the MPH as well, both the RPM and MPH must be set for the 4T65E, not sure how the 4T60 works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXGTP
Recommended WOT PRM for 1>2 & 2>3 shift?
A tranny in good shape will take at least 200 to 300 RPM to complete the shift, up to 500 RPM if it'* worn a bit. Make sure your expected completed shift RPM is below the value set for the rev limiter.

If you need more info on the stock setting then drop me an email.

Cheers,
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Old 01-26-2007, 12:46 AM   #6
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Very nice, thanks,

It good just to get the tips of the world of Bonneville.
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Old 01-26-2007, 03:09 AM   #7
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Since it has a stock pump I wouldn't go past 6200 rpms for shifting WOT.
I would say its also a good place to shift due to retarding the timing.
After you shift you want to be at peak power, unless it drops off rapidly.
Money permitting, a new dyno would show you the best place to shift.
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Old 01-26-2007, 06:55 PM   #8
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Are yo saying the 4T60-E has a shotty fluid pump?

I think I have received some good information and I'll download his program first and make a few slight adjustments before we hit the road and start drivablity tuning. I don't know about a dyno thou.
I have a wideband, I was thinking about getting a spare harness, its like $55.00 and this would allow me to plug it into the cig lighter and stuff the sensor in the tailpipe like they do on the Dyno'*. This should make it easier to tune most cars.
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Old 01-26-2007, 07:17 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXGTP
Are yo saying the 4T60-E has a shotty fluid pump?
Yep. It has 9 vanes vs the 65'* 11.
I had my gm reman 4t60-e shifting at 6600 and after a couple wot runs it couldn't maintain enough line pressure to shift. I changed the fluid and bumped the shifts back down to 6400. I rarely went wot since I was trying to make the trans last but it did shift at 6400 after that.
I've also read that the efficiency of the 60 pump drops drastically after 5800.
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Old 01-27-2007, 01:07 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95naSTA
Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXGTP
Are yo saying the 4T60-E has a shotty fluid pump?
Yep. It has 9 vanes vs the 65'* 11.
I had my gm reman 4t60-e shifting at 6600 and after a couple wot runs it couldn't maintain enough line pressure to shift. I changed the fluid and bumped the shifts back down to 6400. I rarely went wot since I was trying to make the trans last but it did shift at 6400 after that.
I've also read that the efficiency of the 60 pump drops drastically after 5800.
Ok, thanks,
Interesting, I have the manual for all the GM transaxels and never really counted the pump impellers.

I guess we need to be sure to take care of Ben'* trans then.
Maybe I'll have to get Ben a slot at ADC... Arizona Dyno Chip and see where his torque curve is and give him the best shift we can in the high 5k rpm range. We don't want to hose him up with a disposable trans now do we.

We can log a few shifts and time the shifts to see how long they are taking.
With my GTP - 4T65-E I can change the timing of the shift so with 80% or greater throttle, I can decide actually, I can reduce the shift timing. e.g. with my race program my 1>2 and 2.3 shifts are less then one second. I believe I actually increased the time because it was breaking the tires loose too much on the 1>2 shift and it was effecting the et slightly.
Anyway....Hopefully Ben'* 97 Bonneville has a simmilliar parameter.

Ok, Later,
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