HEADERS ARE ON -WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning Talk about modifications, or anything else associated with performance enhancements. Have a new idea for performance/reliability? Post it here. No idea is stupid! (please use Detailing and Appearance for cosmetic ideas)

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Old 10-28-2002, 09:54 PM   #1
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Default HEADERS ARE ON -WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I had my TOG headers installed last week. However, I didn't get to drive the car anywhere because needed 98 GTP dipstick - stock one is too wide and straight.

The dipstick is in and trans fluid toped off. One word - absolutely amazing. I totally endorse this mod and suggest you do it even with a stock pulley.

I have a 3.25 Pulley, gatorback belt, and thasher CAI in my 2002 SSEi. The thasher CAI is for the GTP. I had my shop cut it to fit fender and fascia of Bonneville.

The car'* powerband and delivery is simply amazing now. The torque curve is deeper and flater especially in higher rpms. The engine delivers power smoothly and revs freely.

The car is even more deceptly fast because it is so much smoother and believe or not less noisey than with stock headers. I actually hear less supercharger win and intake roar, probably because of less boost stacking.

I totally need an LSD and higher final drive ratio to take full advantage of this new power. I would love to add rockers too.

I am a hugh fan of torque, especially given my high way driving and our relatively tall gearing. The engine has not suffered any loss of torque at low RPMs. I would say it e has even more low end torque, because it seems to be flowing all that low rpm boost from the smaller pulley.

I am litterally afraid to go WOT in this car now due to still having the stock transmission - especially in first (open differential).

I know it is expensive and a lot of work to install yourself. I had it done by a local aut-shop - which usually works on exotics. They charged me $400 to put it in and did an excellent job.

Here is my new personal recommendations for mods in order. This doesn't reflect the order of mods to my car. However, it was seems to be a good order based on the results of doing other mods first.

Wheels and tires. These will improve your acceleration, braking, and cornering. The SSEi is traction limited right from the factory. I suggest 18X8.5 and 245/45 rubber. These will preserve your overall wheel diameter and thus gearing - plus speedometer calibration. You will also get a wider contact patch without a lot of sidewall flex - for crisp predictable sudden transitions and high speed manuevers. You could also do 19X9 and 255/35. However, its hard to find wheel/ties in this size and they are very expensive.

CAI and Downpipe - power boost from removing intake and exhaust restrictions that apparently effect even the stock engine. I only have CAI. I am not sure downpipe is worthwile if you do headers and flex pipe. I put my CAI in at the same time as going to 3.25. Hence, I really can't testify to its value - as car really needed headers with that pulley. I had them on back order, and got way to anxious.

3.4 Pulley - a great boost in horsepower and torque even with stock exhaust and intake, and not to hard on stock transmission. I would go with a swappable system. It is really worth it. I regret not getting one. This lets you now only easily go smaller as you do other mods, but lets you experiment and adjust to weather or altitude.

Intense Transaxle with 3.69 Final Drive - I know this is unusual and expensive to put early in the list. However, I think this is a good idea to do as soon as possible. You eliminate the major weak point in the drive train. You also further reduce your traction issues. I would especially recommend this mod if you drag race the car. You also take fuller advantage of the cars powerband especially in second and third gear. I will probably do this after installing rockers. However, at least an LSD is probably worth doing very early in the mod cycle.

Headers - These seem to get rid of all the KR problems and high end restrictions. The result a boost in power throughout the band especially with a smaller pulley. The impact will probably be even more signficant with LSD and higher FDR. You can get more use out of first gear by putting power to the ground, and take fuller advantage of high end power.

Rockers - Open up engine and intake and exhaust to flow even more high rpm boost and power.

You will probably start loosing low end torque at this point with a 3.4 pulley. I would suggest going to a 3.25 either after headers or headers and rockers, depending on your altitude/temp, car, and driving style. You may even get away with a 3.0 with headers and rockers in the car. The swappable system really pays off here.
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Old 10-28-2002, 11:58 PM   #2
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MWUHAHAHAHA!!!
BONNEVILLE POWA!!!!!
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Old 10-29-2002, 01:39 AM   #3
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I noticed you didn't mention the 180į thermostat and extra tranny cooler. I'm a big fan of both of these safety measures. Have you done it yet? They should be at the #1 spot in your list.

Car sounds great! I wish I had your budget. It would be fun to give scott a run for the money and spank some gtp'* at the track.
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Old 10-29-2002, 11:50 AM   #4
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Where did you get the headers ??? Where they tuned ?? High-flow ??? Do they have a website ?? I"ve been digging high and low for a good set of headers for my 97 SSEI ( without having to find a good reliable custom made one.. or the kinda money )
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Old 10-29-2002, 01:03 PM   #5
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Iím heading down to the post office today to send hector (from angry duck) some headers and he will have a header option for our cars soon. This will most likely mean cheaper cost and no mods required. The reason he hasnít produced them yet is because I have laged on sending them. Ill have them off today. Iím sure he will let you know as soon as they arrive.

Ty
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Old 10-29-2002, 01:05 PM   #6
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Hey drifter they are 1997 headers I am sending hector maybe once he has tested them he will sell em to ya.

Ty
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Old 10-29-2002, 01:20 PM   #7
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Hey Ty... that would be awsome.... I"ve been wanting to jump pass 3.4" pulley down to 3.25" but have been told that if I don't do the headers/downpipe.. then I'm going to run into high KRs... You rock Ty.. and Hector
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Old 10-29-2002, 04:38 PM   #8
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in two days hector will have the headers/manifolds.

So starting Monday lets bug hector about how fast he can make em. Just kidding.

Ty
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Old 10-29-2002, 10:22 PM   #9
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Hehe, more pressure huh? Not a problem. As soon as I get the manifolds I am going to start working on some headers immediately as well as turbo manifold to make the world'* first turbo Bonneville. And I know about that dipstick problemo with the TOG headers. I am making headers specifically for a Bonneville and then for Grand Prix'*. I am going to try my best and make them tuned for low power as well as top end. Plus the prototype and most likely the production version will be in stainless steel, the TOG headers are not even that.

-Hector
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Old 10-29-2002, 11:44 PM   #10
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Default Angry Duck and TOG Headers

I put the TOG headers for the Grand Prix in my car. I believe the headers actually fit and are tuned for any 3800SC.

I haven't done the thermo stat or colder plugs. I don't do enough sustained WOT driving to avoid running too cold or fouling plugs with them.

I don't know about giving scott a run for his money. He has a lot of custom work in his car that probably can't be duplicated with any budge.

I also have a 2001 Grand Prix GTP - which I let my mom use as a daily driver. The GTP has a 3.4 pulley, front/rear sway bars, front/rear stut tower braces, and 18X5 wheels with 245/45 rubber.

Right now the SSEi seems to be faster of the two, and the GTP is the corner carver. The SSEi was actually more agile and handled better up until strut tower braces and sway bars - and still isn't too far behind. The big wheels really let the bonnie take full advantage of the new G platform - shared with Cadillac STS.

I may hold off any mods for a little while and do a trip to Scott'* shop in Columbus, Ohio. I would too have him put in intense rockers and a heavy duty transmission. I may do the rockers first near me, and just go out for the transmission.

I should probably wait for a DHP chip for 2002 SSE to do the transmission with 3:69 final drive.

Otherwise, you wind up with a 100MPH speed limiter even speedometer calibration - due to 4th gear rev limiter.

On the GTP. I wil probably stay with 3.4 pulley and do a a functional ram air hood, cat back, and rockers next.

I am also very interest in a Quife torque biasing differential for the GTP or even SSEi. However, I think it may interfere with SSEi'* stabilitrack system which is awesome.

The system doesn't kick in unless you really need it and then makes just the right correction to put you on track without slowing you down too much. It is very hard to even get it to activate with the fat rubber on the car.
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