Even I can't get rid of the mod bug!!!!!!!!!!! (LONG!) - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning Talk about modifications, or anything else associated with performance enhancements. Have a new idea for performance/reliability? Post it here. No idea is stupid! (please use Detailing and Appearance for cosmetic ideas)

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Old 09-18-2006, 01:42 AM   #1
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Default Even I can't get rid of the mod bug!!!!!!!!!!! (LONG!)

I've been around this community for a while. I've seen every different kind of setup you could imagine on these cars, I've seen what works and what doesn't work. I've also drawn up my own conclusions on the best way to go as far as horsepower vs. $.

I finally decided to actually pick up a 97+ to help me kinda fit in the community better, not only that but because it was a good deal as well. This happened in Feb. when I bought my GT. Now being a GT I thought it would help me because I figured no blower meant no really big mods really. Well, it came down to it and I ended up putting a blower on it anyways, and a cam at the same time as well.

Considering that the supercharger and cam dropped my times ~1.5 seconds and increased my traps 10mph I thought it would be enough. And don't get me wrong, the car is quick and hauls *** for a daily driver and I enjoy the **** out of it. I though I'd be able to hold myself back, and at the prices of mods I thought I'd be able to. Up until now I really have been able to.

However, a couple weeks ago I stumbled across posts about pacesetter headers. I saw what people were saying about them and the issues they were having and how they fit and whatnot. They didn't seem like they were too bad, and with 1 3/4 primarys they can't be too bad. I wasn't considering really spending any good amount of money on my car so I didn't even look at them. But a couple days later I was chatting with a friend and he mentioned that they were only like $300. I got to looking around and was impressed that I could get 1 3/4" headers WITH a 3" downpipe shipped to my door for $410. Considering my car still has manifolds and a stock downpipe, that is like the biggest thing holding me back. I had to bite and I ordered a set. It HAS to give me a pretty big gain considering the power level I'm at with manifolds and a 2.1" downpipe.

You would think I'd be done. And I thought I was. I said if I saw 12.9'* with this car I would be happy. (of course before that I just said I wanted something that ran SOLIDLY in the 13'*) I know the setup I have now is capable of 12'*, so even getting the headers wasn't really necessary to meet this goal.

HOWEVER, I was browsing clubgp. Now I never look at the classifieds but I was bored so I figured I'd look through to see what there was available. I see someone has a full size ZZP I/C so out of curiosity I take a look. It is the core, the radiator, a pump, and some of the lines, and a machined LIM, but its missing some of the lines, brackets for the radiator, and the pump I don't think would be sufficient for the system. The guy was asking $600 for it. Knowing that I could make this system complete for less than $100 more I knew this was a steal. (I know my dad has his old pump sitting around at home since he upgraded to a GM pump, and gaskets, hoses, bolts, and other misc. hardware won't add up to more than $100.) I also already have a machined lower intake. So I talk to the guy and ended up getting everything but the intake from him for $520 shipped!!!! For about $600 I should be able to have a complete FULL SIZE intercooler. So take the $400 for the headers and $600 for the I/C and figure I should see EASILY a 50whp gain, probably more like 60whp+ gain from both together, and for $1k total thats a good deal!

I should be installing all this within the next couple weeks here and then we will take it out and see what its capable of. IMO with this setup the car should EASILY go mid 12'*, and IMO with a good launch and a little weight reduction I honestly think I can massage it down into the high 11'*. However, a 2 second gain from where the car was when I bought it (14.639 when it was N/A) would please me. If nothing else the car should definately be a very fun daily driver.

I will keep you guys updated on the progress of the car and definately get you pics of the install and before & after. I hope to have it all tuned in for IDD and will be making some baseline runs on street tires with full weight.

Considering that including the I/C & headers, I still have a total of around $4400 into the car (including what the car itself cost) I think I'm doing pretty good for what I have invested. I do realize that I do have quite a few weak points that will need to be addressed after not too long running this setup. (the tranny is the biggest concern, my 216k mile bottom end is up there too but I think it will hold up as long as I don't get too carried away with timing or boost.)

Shawn
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Old 09-18-2006, 01:45 AM   #2
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Damn Shawn, we have a SS intercooler for sale right now!

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Old 09-18-2006, 03:28 AM   #3
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$4400 GT(p) that might run 11'*

love it!
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Old 09-18-2006, 11:08 AM   #4
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I don't like you anymore.




J/K Sounds awesome. How about you take my L36 and I take your supercharged and intercooled L36?
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Old 09-18-2006, 12:52 PM   #5
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Awesome Shawn....i dont anyone has pushed a L36 as for as you have...awesome to see
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Old 09-18-2006, 01:22 PM   #6
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it baffles me that it was a high 14'* n/a GT like a month and a half ago. that car is awesome
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Old 09-18-2006, 02:26 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1993 SLE
Awesome Shawn....i dont anyone has pushed a L36 as for as you have...awesome to see
Lots of GTP guys run L36 bottom ends when they get into the heavy builds. Zooomers M90 setup was with an L36 bottom end, as were MANY MANY other setups. And ZZP'* SS M90 kit car runs mid 11'* IIRC. How many of those cars are real daily drivers though? I drive mine everyday and pull off 29mpg on the freeway even with my 3.29 gears! :P

However, I doubt very many people have pushed L36'* with over 200k miles this far.

Quote:
it baffles me that it was a high 14'* n/a GT like a month and a half ago. that car is awesome
Its pretty crazy to think about isn't it? I say that everyday. And to think if it weren't for my broken flexplate, I wouldn't have even supercharged it in the first place.

Quote:
$4400 GT(p) that might run 11'*

love it!
Its definately badass. Yeah, its far from the nicest 97+ out there, but for the money invested its pretty bad *** IMO. I have just been very lucky so far at finding good deals. If it weren't for just being in the right place at the right time a few different times, this could've easily cost me a lot more money. I know I'm gonna need a trans really really quick here though.
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Old 09-18-2006, 04:29 PM   #8
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Kinda hard to call it an L36 now anyways

High compression FTW.
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Old 09-19-2006, 12:53 AM   #9
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You are an animal, my friend. I dig it.

You takin' aim at your dad'* GTP??
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Old 09-19-2006, 04:39 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chadow427
You takin' aim at your dad'* GTP??
Well, yes and no. I'm not really trying to "beat" it, but my goal in the end is to run as well as its current PB.

Here is the thing about that car. That car is a LOADED '02 GTP. It is a 4 door car with a sunroof and has every option. Even if he completely gutted it, he would still be 100lbs. heavier than my car due to the fact that its a 4 door with a sunroof and I'm a 2 door with no sunroof. His car is a 40th anniversary so it has the roof fences, the bigger rear spoiler, and hood scoops. His car has HUD, magnasteer, onstar, and I'm sure some other things I can't think of right now, mine has none of that. He also has BMR front and rear sway bars which are the heaviest bars made for the w-bodies....mine is stock. He has stb'*, I don't. He has gmpp trailing arms, I don't. He has a full stainless steel exhaust with resonator and whatnot, I have a stock catback with the resonator cut out. Honestly, in street trim I think his car is probably a SOLID 300lbs. heavier.

Even if I do go as fast as that car, my car is nowhere near as nice, and his is WAY heavier. His car with a halfway decent tune and halfway decent driver should be capable of mid 11'* with some weight reduction. (IMO 11.6'* are FAR from unreasonable)

Now when you compare basic mods, our large mods are very similar however there are a TON of small mods that he has that I don't. I'll list both our mod lists so you can compare.

My mods: (after I/C and headers)
Open K&N filter
Pacesetter headers, downpipe, and stock catback with res delete
No EGR
drilled 160 tstat
UD alt & wp pulleys
Powertuned PCM
Mini-afc 1.1
Happy ****
shift kit
XP cam, 90lb. springs, retainers
HumPerformance Ported M90 (stock inlet, just reworked outlet) and Machined Intake
ZZP Full Size I/C, regular core, Radiator 2, rule pump
ZZP MPS (older heavier hub)
Autolite 103 plugs
Not sure, but probably 2.8/2.9/3.0 pulleys.
L36 bottom end (9.4:1 compression)

My car also has stock GT 3.29 gears and 3000 stall convertor.

His mods:
Insulated Thrasher CAI
ZZP Stage 2 Throttle Body
ZZP Stage 4 Ported M90 w/machined snout
ZZP Full Size I/C, half plastic core, radiator 2, gm pump, steel lines
ZZP Machined Intake
PRJ Fuel Rails
42.5lb. injectors
XP cam, 90lb. springs, retainers, OR pushrods
Ceramic & Titanium Coated TOG'*
RT downipe w/no cat
Borla Catback
Autolite 103 plugs
MSD plug wires
ZZP Electric Water Pump
drilled 160 tstat
10% Alt. UD Pulley
ZZP MPS
2.45/2.55/2.6/2.7 pulleys
8 rib belt setup
ZZP Transmission, input shaft, output shaft, pump shaft, 3.29 gears, diff squirter, etc...
ZZP 2500 stall convertor
SFPHQ Halfshafts
Grand Am front brakes
cross drilled/slotted rotors all the way around
Custom DHP PCM
Mini-afc 2.0
Happy ****
Stock L67 bottom end (8.5:1 compression)

So in reality, his setup should be a lot stronger than mine. His blower should be way better. His electric water pump should definately help. His brakes should be a bit lighter. His exhaust setup is way nicer (has nothing to do with performance but his looks and sounds 10x better than mine), and his throttle body is also much better. He also has 42.5lb. injectors, which not having those on my setup will probably hold me back.

Performance wise I'm hoping to run close to what his current PB is, but as you can see his setup should be much stronger than mine as far as reliability goes, and for a daily driver his should be better IMO. His car is way nicer in just about every way, and I'd definately rather have his instead of mine. But, like I said, performance wise, with mine tuned well and his full weight it should be close.

Honestly I don't see me going 11'* without some weight reduction and a lot of tweaking. That is my goal for next year though.
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