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Old 11-12-2009, 01:22 PM   #1
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Default Rememberance Day / Veterans' Day

I am a Canadian, living in Canada and woriking in the US, so I am very hesitant to knock the country that provides me with employment opportunity, but something is really bothering me today.

What the hell happened to Veterans' Day (called Rememberance Day in Canada) in the good old US of A?

In Canada, we wear a poppy on our lapel on Rememberance Day to signify our respect for those who gave their lives so we can can enjoy the freedoms we have. Is this just a Canadian thing? I don't see any in the states, and one of the guys I work with asked me why I had a red flower pinned to my jacket.

I am accustomed to everyone observing a minute of silence at 11:00 AM on the 11th day of the 11th month to honor our fallen. Yesterday at work, there was no announcement, no acknowledgement whatsoever. Business as usual.

Our news paper carries sections to cover ceremonies at the local cenotaph, with pictures of the few veterans still alive and in attendance. Its a big deal. I didn't see anything in the local US papers.

Is it because I am older, and the concept of Veterans' Day is lost on the next generation? Has the US wandered away from observing Veteran'* Day to the point where it has lost its meaning? Am I missing something?

What did you, your company and/or your community do to honor the spirit of Veterans' Day? Some of our members are veterans, and some of those I consider to be my friends. What is your perspective on this?
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Old 11-12-2009, 04:46 PM   #2
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I don't know i spent mine getting yelled at and called a murdered and baby killer cause of the verterans plates on my car how lovely
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Old 11-12-2009, 05:59 PM   #3
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There were quite a few nice Ceremonies, and a special one to the Navajo Indians who used their language as a code the Japanese coulf never crack. But the Media didn't cover most of it. I think because Public sentiment/support is plummeting about our 2 active wars, and a few never quite settled the media seems to have forgot. The casualties have been great in these "Police Actions" with no end in sight, or a firm plan revealed. Both these wars and things we have left hanging in Africa and Macedonia further dim things. In our political correctness and worried about everyone but us, we have forgotten how to fight a war. And the fact war is HELL. It isnt something to legitimize, moralize, and debate while our kids keep getting blown away trying to be legalese thinking Cops with their every move and action videotaped and dissected. Why cant we be realistic and understand they are trying to keep peace in areas where civilian populations care less about life, or freedom, or being civil. And wont make themselves accountable to War Conventions and Rules of Engagement. Patriotism was high after the 9-11 attacks, but the whole mess went south and so did support. Either the Government adopts a "fight like our life and freedom depends on it" or it'* not worth that, so lets get out attitude; or it'* public sentiment is going to continue to sour at a faster pace.
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Old 11-12-2009, 06:08 PM   #4
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Well said Venom well said
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Old 11-12-2009, 06:26 PM   #5
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I guess the big difference between Canada and the US is our Rememberance Day is thought of as mainly focused on WW1 and WW2. Wars seen by the general public as "righteous" and "just". In the States, Veteran'* Day brings to mind many other conflicts, including current ones, many of which the American people do not believe in.

Rememberance Day, or Veteran'* Day, shouldn't be about the war. It should be about the people who laid down their lives fighting for our freedoms. The war is political, and most rational people will say we shouldn't have wars. Not believing in a war should not equate to hating the men and women who serve their country. It makes me sick when I think about the Vietnam veterans who were treated like cast off garbage because the war wasn't "popular". It bothers me to hear Sawgunner describe how he is treated as a veteran.

I think I am starting to understand why Veterans' Day is not observed to the level that Rememberance Day is. I think its wrong, but I think I see the difference.
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Old 11-12-2009, 07:09 PM   #6
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I believe, IMO; that much of the loss of respect for Veterans has much to with the current generation. For the most part they probably do not have living relatives who are true war veterans, and that have shared or instilled the value of service and the cost of freedom. Most of the 'war' or military action this new and vocal generation has seen, were related to police actions or conflicts. The last recorded war that the US was involved in was the Desert Shield/Desert Storm - 18 years ago!

Veterans of decreed wars of great conflict, WWI, WWII, etc.; were seen as liberators from tyrannical oppression on foreign lands. For Vietnam, the first truly televised conflict; showed the atrocities of war in raw form and nobody was prepared for the truth.

The VC conflict created a disparagingly harsh rules of engagement requirements for US military, when the VC starting using the tactics of hiding among civilian villagers. The aftermath of skirmishes published in Time and Look magazine showed old women and children dead or horrifically disfigured. This immediately brought public judgment on the military machine as being the killers of old women and children, and that had echoed since. Of course there was the My Lai Massacre that did not help the military'* public perception.

I'm not offering excuses nor taking the side of generation who is ungrateful due to the lack of historical understanding of the price paid and the cost to maintain the freedoms they now have.

So to those veterans I have yet to say Thank You from the bottom of my heart - Thank you for your service, dedication and endurance to keeping us free and to the sacrifices you've made and continue to make in light of public opinion. Those the belittle or condemn your service are ill informed and morons who care only for themselves and not others. Thank You, Thank You, Thank You! there are much more of us who care and praise your efforts than those who cast doubt on them.

This is all about the ultimate sacrifices made by our men and woemn of the US Armed Forces....here'* some stats from the US Veterans Administration:

America’* Wars Total (1775 -1991)
  • U.*. Military Service during Wartime 41,891,368
  • Battle Deaths 651,030
  • Other Deaths (In Theater) 308,800
  • Other Deaths in Service (Non-Theater) 230,279
  • Non-mortal Woundings 1,431,290
  • Living War Veterans 17,456,000
  • Living Veterans (Periods of War & Peace) 23,442,000

Here'* some stats on the Global War On Terror.
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Old 11-12-2009, 11:40 PM   #7
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I see your points Kevin and share the sentiments you provided. Ands thanks for the high road approach. I was merely trying to elaborate on the question. This new generation, I cant find the reasoning to blame them. They are what we as the whole of society made them. Where is the Todays Hero'* we still found as kids so easy to point too. Where anywhere in the present world do they find common examples of integrity. I'm not going to play the blame game, or try to write out my feeling about it. But the world failed them. Me included. Nuclear family'*, living to what the media portrays we should be, they are the product of the "Me" generation'* guidance. More correctly, lack of.
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Old 11-13-2009, 08:22 PM   #8
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As a veteran I am always moved by any sincere recognition of Veterans Day. By that I mean any gesture no matter how small that is not staged for political purposes. Too often politicians are just doing what their job demands of them but a thoughtful discussion such as this means more than any of that. I have the utmost respect for any veteran. More often than not they enlist as a patriotic gesture with no real clue as to how the experience will impact their lives and few outside of the veterans themselves and their families realize the challenges whether during times of war or peace. The important thing is that they continue to do there job and that spirit, that sense of pride in what they do goes beyond their military service. It is who they are, the military is just one of the ways that they are expressing who they are. Not to say that only good people serve in the military or that those who do not are not good people but these individual have stepped up. They want to make a difference. They have good intentions and are often missled and taken advantage of then tossed aside. Unfortunately that is the world that we are living in and even more reason why I have such high regard for those who have, do, and will serve our country. Yes, it is strange how we as a country tend to trot out our oldest veterans once a year and wave flags, etc. We live in an imperfect society but there are heroes among us. And lets not forget all of the civilians who support the troops around the world. Sometimes they are the only link to anything familiar for those who are far from home here and abroad. Happy Veterans Day to all who have served on this site and your loved ones as well. You are not forgotten.

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Old 11-13-2009, 08:47 PM   #9
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USA has changed over the last few decades. Most holidays are about drinking and watching sports. Just the way it is. I am active duty Army and am in DC for six weeks and Veterans day for the masses here was about drinking from my observation. An excuse to drink, not have a drink to pay true respect.

2k, I had the privilege to visit the Canadian Battlefields in Sicily and France a few years ago. I had no idea Canada entered WW I two years before the USA and how high their casualty count was. I visited the Canadian cemeteries in Europe also. Very somber but glad to visit- well worth a trip if you can. Unlike the USA, Canadian'* bury their war dead at the place they die.
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Old 11-14-2009, 12:37 AM   #10
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Canada and Great Britian were in WW1 almost 3 years before the US declared war on Germany. The US joined the conflict in response to U boats sinking large numbers of US cargo ships.

In the days before battle front news coverage, the common soldier was nothing more than cannon fodder. The death toll was inconceivable.
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