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View Poll Results: Traction Control on or off when racing off the line?
Traction on 6 23.08%
Traction off 20 76.92%
Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-21-2003, 10:57 PM   #11
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As long as you keep the fluid changed those trannies should hold up pretty well. Aux coolers help too. Keeps the fluid from breaking down. I'm putting one of those in soon.

Mines got 107,000 on it, ive been running her sorta hard and shes still tight as ever.
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Old 06-22-2003, 12:16 AM   #12
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i think in our cars that traction control pulls timing, and in a race that is really a bad thing...
 
Old 06-22-2003, 12:30 AM   #13
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Definitely turn OFF the traction control.
Only newbies to racing turn it on. If you don't know your cars limits you shouldn't be racing.
Yes, leaving the traction control on will pull your timing and apply your brakes as soon as the tires spin, both of which are not condusive to winning races.
Those of us lucky enough to have the torque of a supercharged engine know that a little bit of tire slip, not outright spinning, will give the best times.....but then if you are also lucky enough to have sticky slicks, it won't matter.
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Old 06-22-2003, 03:53 AM   #14
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What I do is take traction off to roast em to get them warm and grippy and then leave it off so I can get max launch and make sure my tires dont spin afterwards.
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Old 06-22-2003, 05:22 PM   #15
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Quote:
If you do end up spinning the tires it cuts off fuel and engages the breaks. You definately don't want that. They tell you how it works in the Manual. So just learn how to launch with it off and you'll be set. I know where my tires will spin so i bring it up right before that.
Quote:
i think in our cars that traction control pulls timing, and in a race that is really a bad thing...
Quote:
Definitely turn OFF the traction control.
Only newbies to racing turn it on. If you don't know your cars limits you shouldn't be racing.
Yes, leaving the traction control on will pull your timing and apply your brakes as soon as the tires spin, both of which are not condusive to winning races.
Those of us lucky enough to have the torque of a supercharged engine know that a little bit of tire slip, not outright spinning, will give the best times.....but then if you are also lucky enough to have sticky slicks, it won't matter.
All of these posts I quoted are basically true. In all of my work trying to deal with the traction control system on the GTP so we could make decent runs at the track, I will tell you from my research and experience, DO NOT leave it on. With the traction control on it will pull timing (give you KR) even if you just chirp the tires, the longer you spin the tires, the more KR it will give you, the KR recovery rate (the rate at which it takes away the KR and gives you your timing back) is something like 1 degree every 3 seconds. So, if you chirp your tires and get 5 kr (this is usually about what you will get from just chirping the tires), you will lose 5 degrees of timing, which is somewhere between an 8 and 15 horsepower loss, and then you will get 1 degree back every 3 seconds after the tires aren't spinning. You barely even have all your timing back by the time the race is over and all you did was get a little tire chirp (assuming you race for 15 seconds). Another thing I have observed but don't know if it is true or not yet, is that with the TCS on it will pull timing if you accelerate faster then the computer thinks you should, so it assumes that your tires are spinning and pulls timing (I don't know if it actually does this, I have just started researching it from concluding it by observing weird KR readings in the SSEi with the TCS on that it wouldn't get with the TCS off). However, unless you get MASSIVE tire spin, the TCS will not engage the brakes. There is something like 8 stages in the traction control system and engaging the brakes is like stage 6 or something, pulling timing is stage 1. Even if you are bad at getting the tires to not spin turn it off, because eventually they will stick and you will have all your power, whereas if you let the TCS find the grip for you, you won't have any power once it does. As soon as we get in either the SSEi or GTP we turn the traction control off, even if we are just driving down the freeway.
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Old 06-22-2003, 10:33 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbtk2
Quote:
If you do end up spinning the tires it cuts off fuel and engages the breaks. You definately don't want that. They tell you how it works in the Manual. So just learn how to launch with it off and you'll be set. I know where my tires will spin so i bring it up right before that.
Quote:
i think in our cars that traction control pulls timing, and in a race that is really a bad thing...
Quote:
Definitely turn OFF the traction control.
Only newbies to racing turn it on. If you don't know your cars limits you shouldn't be racing.
Yes, leaving the traction control on will pull your timing and apply your brakes as soon as the tires spin, both of which are not condusive to winning races.
Those of us lucky enough to have the torque of a supercharged engine know that a little bit of tire slip, not outright spinning, will give the best times.....but then if you are also lucky enough to have sticky slicks, it won't matter.
All of these posts I quoted are basically true. In all of my work trying to deal with the traction control system on the GTP so we could make decent runs at the track, I will tell you from my research and experience, DO NOT leave it on. With the traction control on it will pull timing (give you KR) even if you just chirp the tires, the longer you spin the tires, the more KR it will give you, the KR recovery rate (the rate at which it takes away the KR and gives you your timing back) is something like 1 degree every 3 seconds. So, if you chirp your tires and get 5 kr (this is usually about what you will get from just chirping the tires), you will lose 5 degrees of timing, which is somewhere between an 8 and 15 horsepower loss, and then you will get 1 degree back every 3 seconds after the tires aren't spinning. You barely even have all your timing back by the time the race is over and all you did was get a little tire chirp (assuming you race for 15 seconds). Another thing I have observed but don't know if it is true or not yet, is that with the TCS on it will pull timing if you accelerate faster then the computer thinks you should, so it assumes that your tires are spinning and pulls timing (I don't know if it actually does this, I have just started researching it from concluding it by observing weird KR readings in the SSEi with the TCS on that it wouldn't get with the TCS off). However, unless you get MASSIVE tire spin, the TCS will not engage the brakes. There is something like 8 stages in the traction control system and engaging the brakes is like stage 6 or something, pulling timing is stage 1. Even if you are bad at getting the tires to not spin turn it off, because eventually they will stick and you will have all your power, whereas if you let the TCS find the grip for you, you won't have any power once it does. As soon as we get in either the SSEi or GTP we turn the traction control off, even if we are just driving down the freeway.
Interesting and important. Glad you did the research to inform us all.
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Old 06-22-2003, 11:03 PM   #17
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Quote:
As soon as we get in either the SSEi or GTP we turn the traction control off, even if we are just driving down the freeway.
That'* what I do too. I always turn it off.
If it is off, does the computer pull timing if you spin the tires excessively, like in a burn out for instance?
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Old 06-23-2003, 12:09 AM   #18
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thanks for ur help hehe i still need to learn a little more about when my tires will spin or not but i think ive basically got it down i usually dont spin
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Old 06-23-2003, 01:30 AM   #19
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Quote:
If it is off, does the computer pull timing if you spin the tires excessively, like in a burn out for instance?
Only in the SSEi. Turning off the TCS only delays when it kicks in. When you turn it off it will wait a few seconds (a long time in the world of racing) before pulling timing instead of doing it immediately. Basically it will let you do about as much spin as you would on a launch, any more than that and it will pull timing, but waiting a few seconds before pulling timing helps ET'* SIGNIFICANTLY because you don't get the timing pulled so you have as much power as you can get for the whole 1/8 or 1/4 mile.

Supposedly it will in the GTP also, but not as bad, the Bonnevilles traction control is supposed the be the GTP'* traction control system made worse, but we always pull the fuse when doing burnouts so I don't know for sure, and I have never experienced it on the street while I have been monitoring with the fuse in. I will probably in the near future write a write up on the GTP and SSEi traction control systems to explain exactly how they work and what they do in every situation, but I don't feel I have enough information to do it yet.
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Old 06-23-2003, 01:43 AM   #20
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Quote:
Basically it will let you do about as much spin as you would on a launch, any more than that and it will pull timing, but waiting a few seconds before pulling timing helps ET'* SIGNIFICANTLY because you don't get the timing pulled so you have as much power as you can get for the whole 1/8 or 1/4 mile.
So if I understand you correctly, as long as the tire spinning is less than a few seconds, the timing won't get pulled......but if you spin for more than a few seconds, like in a burn-out, the timing will get pulled.

I suppose the fuse you pull is the anti-lock brakes for the GTP...but you can't pull a fuse to avoid the timing retard.
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