Slick 50 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


General GM Chat When starting new posts, please specify YEAR, MAKE, MODEL, ENGINE type, and whatever modifications you have made. Chat about all things GM (and related cars). Off-topic stuff should be in the Lounge, and all Model specific mechanical problems should be posted in the proper forum.

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-25-2007, 09:40 AM   #1
Senior Member
Posts like a Northstar
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Edinboro, PA
Posts: 567
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
jbmark33 is on a distinguished road
Default Slick 50

Got some slick 50 for christmas... is this pretty good stuff?
jbmark33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 10:32 AM   #2
Senior Member
Certified GM nut
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: allentown, pa--brooklyn, ny
Posts: 1,646
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
88bonnsse is on a distinguished road
Default

is it the transmission fluid.? if so get the recipt and return it as fast as you can...
88bonnsse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 10:47 AM   #3
Senior Member
Posts like a Northstar
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Edinboro, PA
Posts: 567
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
jbmark33 is on a distinguished road
Default

nope its engine treatment, advanced treatment...

http://www.slick50.com/products/AdvFormulaEngineTrt.htm
jbmark33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:02 AM   #4
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
banned3800 is on a distinguished road
Default

I am not a fan of the stuff..

But if you use it.... Make sure you don't go too far over the 3000 mile oil change interval..

__________________
Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
banned3800 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:04 AM   #5
Senior Member
Posts like a Northstar
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Edinboro, PA
Posts: 567
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
jbmark33 is on a distinguished road
Default

What specifically makes you not too fond of it?
jbmark33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:08 AM   #6
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 0
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
banned3800 is on a distinguished road
Default

The PTFE is a solid....Its like a powder thats really fine and suspended in 10-30 oil... I'd rather use a nice big container of Mobil 1

You can use the Slick 50... Just change the oil at the 3000 mile interval..

__________________
Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
banned3800 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:12 AM   #7
Junior Member
Posts like a Ricer Type-R
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
willwren is on a distinguished road
Default

The fact that it'* bogus. Even Dupont knows this, but has to be very careful in what they say due to licensing PTFE to them for use in the product.

http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=sli...p=mss&ei=UTF-8

Quote:
Currently, the most common and popular oil additives on the market are those that contain PTFE powders suspended in a regular, over-the-counter type, 50-rated petroleum or synthetic engine oil. PTFE is the common abbreviation used for Polytetrafloeraethylene, more commonly known by the trade name "Teflon," which is a registered trademark of the DuPont Chemical Corporation. Among those oil additives we have identified as containing PTFE are: Slick 50, Liquid Ring, Lubrilon, Microlon, Matrix, Petrolon (same company as Slick 50), QMl, and T-Plus (K-Mart). There are probably many more names in use on many more products using PTFE. We have found that oil additive makers like to market their products under a multitude of "private brand" names.
While some of these products may contain other additives in addition to PTFE, all seem to rely on the PTFE as their primary active ingredient and all, without exception, do not list what other ingredients they may contain.

Though they have gained rather wide acceptance among the motoring public, oil additives containing PTFE have also garnered their share of critics among experts in the field of lubrication. By far the most damning testimonial against these products originally came from the DuPont Chemical Corporation, inventor of PTFE and holder of the patents and trademarks for Teflon. In a statement issued about ten years ago, DuPont'* Fluoropolymers Division Product Specialist, J.F. Imbalzano said, "Teflon is not useful as an ingredient in oil additives or oils used for internal combustion engines."

At the time, DuPont threatened legal action against anyone who used the name "Teflon" on any oil product destined for use in an internal combustion engine, and refused to sell its PTFE powders to any one who intended to use them for such purposes.

After a flurry of lawsuits from oil additive makers, claiming DuPont could not prove that PTFE was harmful to engines, DuPont was forced to once again begin selling their PTFE to the additive producers. The additive makers like to claim this is some kind of "proof' that their products work, when in fact it is nothing more than proof that the American legal ethic of "innocent until proven guilty" is still alive and well. The decision against DuPont involved what is called "restraint of trade." You can't refuse to sell a product to someone just because there is a possibility they might use it for a purpose other than what you intended it for.

It should be noted that DuPont'* official position on the use of PTFE in engine oils remains carefully aloof and noncommittal, for obvious legal reasons. DuPont states that though they sell PTFE to oil additive producers, they have "no proof of the validity of the additive makers' claims." They further state that they have "no knowledge of any advantage gained through the use of PTFE in engine oil."

Fear of potential lawsuits for possible misrepresentation of a product seem to run much higher among those with the most to lose.

After DuPont'* decision and attempt to halt the use of PTFE in engine oils, several of the oil additive companies simply went elsewhere for their PTFE powders, such as purchasing them in other countries. In some cases, they disguise or hype their PTFE as being something different or special by listing it under one of their own tradenames. That doesn't change the fact that it is still PTFE.

In addition, there is some evidence that certain supplies of PTFE powders (from manufacturers other than DuPont) are of a cruder version than the original, made with larger sized flakes that are more likely to "settle out" in your oil or clog up your filters. One fairly good indication that a product contains this kind of PTFE is if the instructions for its use advise you to "shake well before using." It only stands to reason that if the manufacturer knows the solids in his product will settle to the bottom of a container while sitting on a shelf, the same thing is going to happen inside your engine when it is left idle for any period of time.

The problem with putting PTFE in your oil, as explained to us by several industry experts, is that PTFE is a solid. The additive makers claim this solid "coats" the moving parts in an engine (though that is far from being scientifically proven). Slick 50 is currently both the most aggressive advertiser and the most popular seller, with claims of over 14 million treatments sold. However, such solids seem even more inclined to coat non-moving parts, like oil passages and filters. After all, if it can build up under the pressures and friction exerted on a cylinder wall, then it stands to reason it should build up even better in places with low pressures and virtually no friction.

This conclusion seems to be borne out by tests on oil additives containing PTFE conducted by the NASA Lewis Research Center, which said in their report, "In the types of bearing surface contact we have looked at, we have seen no benefit. In some cases we have seen detrimental effect. The solids in the oil tend to accumulate at inlets and act as a dam, which simply blocks the oil from entering. Instead of helping, it is actually depriving parts of lubricant."

Remember, PTFE in oil additives is a suspended solid. Now think about why you have an oil filter on your engine. To remove suspended solids, right? Right. Therefore it would seem to follow that if your oil filter is doing its job, it will collect as much of the PTFE as possible, as quickly as possible. This can result in a clogged oil filter and decreased oil pressure throughout your engine.

In response to our inquiries about this sort of problem, several of the PTFE pushers responded that their particulates were of a sub-micron size, capable of passing through an ordinary oil filter unrestricted. This certainly sounds good, and may in some cases actually be true, but it makes little difference when you know the rest of the story. You see, PTFE has other qualities besides being a friction reducer: It expands radically when exposed to heat. So even if those particles are small enough to pass through your filter when you purchase them, they very well may not be when your engine reaches normal operating temperature.

Here again, the scientific evidence seems to support this, as in tests conducted by researchers at the University of Utah Engineering Experiment Station involving Petrolon additive with PTFE.

The Petrolon test report states, "There was a pressure drop across the oil filter resulting from possible clogging of small passageways." In addition, oil analysis showed that iron contamination doubled after using the treatment, indicating that engine wear didn't go down - it appeared to shoot up.

This particular report was paid for by Petrolon (marketers of Slick 50), and was not all bad news for their products. The tests, conducted on a Chevrolet six-cylinder automobile engine, showed that after treatment with the PTFE additive the test engine'* friction was reduced by 13.1 percent. Also, output horsepower increased from 5.3 percent to 8.1 percent, and fuel economy improved from 11.8 percent under light load to 3.8 percent under heavy load.

These are the kind of results an aggressive marketing company like Petrolon can really sink their teeth into. If we only reported the results in the last paragraph to you, you'd be inclined to think Slick 50 was indeed a magic engine elixir. What you have to keep in mind is that often times the benefits (like increased horse power and fuel economy) may be out weighed by some serious drawbacks (like the indications of [?])


Quote:
Chapter 6 - The Plot Thickens
Just as we were about to go to press with this article, we were contacted by the public relations firm of Trent and Company, an outfit with a prestigious address in the Empire State Building, New York. They advised us they were working for a company called QMI out of Lakeland, Florida, that was marketing a "technological breakthrough" product in oil additives. Naturally, we asked them to send us all pertinent information, including any testing and research data.
What we got was pretty much what we expected. QMI'* oil additive, according to their press release, uses "ten times more PTFE resins than its closest competitor." Using the "unique SX-6000 formula," they say they are the only company to use "aqueous dispersion resin which means the microns (particle sizes) are extensively smaller and can penetrate tight areas." This, they claim, "completely eliminates the problem of clogged filters and oil passages."

Intrigued by their press release, we set up a telephone interview with their Vice-President of Technical Services, Mr. Owen Heatwole. Mr. Heatwole'* name was immediately recognized by us as one that had popped in earlier research of this subject as a former employee of Petrolon, a company whose name seems inextricably linked in some fashion or another with virtually every PTFE-related additive maker in the country.

Mr. Heatwole was a charming and persuasive talker with a knack for avoiding direct answers as good as any seasoned politician. His glib pitch for his product was the best we've ever heard, but when dissected and pared down to the verifiable facts, it actually said very little.

When we asked about the ingredients in QMI'* treatments, we got almost exactly the response we expected. Mr. Heatwole said he would "have to avoid discussing specifics about the formula, for proprietary reasons."

After telling us that QMI was being used by "a major oil company," a "nuclear plant owned by a major corporation" and a "major engine manufacturer," Mr. Heatwole followed up with, "Naturally, I can't reveal their names - for proprietary reasons."

He further claimed to have extensive testing and research data available from a "major laboratory," proving conclusively how effective QMI was. When we asked for the name of the lab, can you guess? Yup, "We can't give out that information, for proprietary reasons."

What QMI did give us was the typical "testimonials," though we must admit theirs came from more recognizable sources than usual. They seem to have won over the likes of both Team Kawasaki and Bobby Unser, who evidently endorse and use QMI in their racing engines. Mr. Heatwole was very proud of the fact that their product was being used in engines that he himself admitted are "torn down and completely inspected on a weekly basis." Of course, what he left out is that those same engines are almost totally rebuilt every time they're torn down. So what does that prove in terms of his product reducing wear and promoting engine longevity?
Virtually nothing.

Mr. Heatwole declined to name the source of QMI'* PTFE supply "for proprietary reasons." He bragged that their product is sold under many different private labels, but refused to identify those labels "for proprietary reasons." When asked about the actual size of the PTFE particles used in QMI, he claimed they were measured as "sub-micron in size" by a "major motor laboratory" which he couldn't identify - you guessed it - for "proprietary reasons."

After about an hour of listening to "don't quote me on this," "I'll have to deny that if you print it," and "I can't reveal that," we asked Mr. Heatwole if there was something we could print. "Certainly," he said, "Here'* a good quote for you: 'The radical growth in technology has overcome the problem areas associated with PTFE in the 1980s'"

"Not bad," we said. Then we asked to whom we might attribute this gem of wisdom. DuPont Chemical, perhaps?
"Me," said Mr. Heatwole. "I said that."

QMI'* press releases like to quote the Guinness Book Of Records in saying that PTFE is "The slickest substance known to man." Far be it from us to take exception to the Guinness Book, but we doubt that PTFE is much slicker than some of the people marketing it.
willwren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:19 AM   #8
Senior Member
Posts like a Northstar
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Edinboro, PA
Posts: 567
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
jbmark33 is on a distinguished road
Default

willwren: Does this mean is has no effect then? or the results are mixed?

Do our engines have small oil passageways?

I don't have to use it, I just got it for christmas from my dad.. not a big deal.
jbmark33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:35 AM   #9
Junior Member
Posts like a Ricer Type-R
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
willwren is on a distinguished road
Default

It means it doesn't work, and that 50-weight carrier COULD cause you problems with the crank bearings.

I wouldn't put it in anything other than the LOOSEST beat up old motor, and then not for the PTFE, as it does nothing, but rather for the 50wt, which is cheaper off the shelf in any other brand.
willwren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-25-2007, 11:46 AM   #10
Senior Member
Posts like a Northstar
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Edinboro, PA
Posts: 567
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
jbmark33 is on a distinguished road
Default

When I gave my dad some ideas I was actually thinking of seafoam top engine cleaner. This is upper intake cleaner right? I will probably return it and look into something else.
jbmark33 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Drag slick,... wich size??? mike_peperni Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning 11 04-23-2006 12:14 PM
Slick 50 Maymybonnieliveforevr General GM Chat 28 04-03-2006 03:34 PM
slick changes repinS Lounge 1 10-19-2005 12:18 AM
Slick 50??? h1081dan 1992-1999 6 10-18-2003 12:00 AM
Slick 50 Engine Treatment and Max Life ATF Kuhl General GM Chat 13 05-12-2003 12:16 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:40 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.