Let's Talk Torque - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


Buick From the Electra, Lesabre, Park Avenue, Regal, to the Grand National. Here's the place for all things "Buick"

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-12-2016, 01:05 AM   #1
Senior Member
Posts like a Turbo
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 358
Thanked 18 Times in 14 Posts
Kimberly will become famous soon enoughKimberly will become famous soon enough
Default Let'* Talk Torque

I am back into the 98 Buick LeSabre. For a year the car has idle rough and when it threw a code it would be lean bank. I checked for vacuum leaks but never could find a "ah, there it is". If you look you can see where I posted about seeing the gasket at the throttle body and plenum. Never got a definitive answer on that one. I did convince Dorman to send me a replacement plenum. So here I am tearing it down all the way to the lower intake in case the lower intake is leaking. It should not have been considering the work I did the first time. I used Felpro lower intake gasket the first time and I was not happy with the quality but I used them and got the engine back together. This time I am using Magnum and I like the "looks" of them much better than the Felpro gaskets. However, this is not about gaskets but about torque.

My question is why is the torque so low on the lower intake manifold; it is around 132 inch pounds. I would think the lower intake could take a higher torque than 132 inch pounds. It is important to distort the gasket material to get a good positive seal. That is how it works, you put a squeeze on it, it distorts, flattens against the intake and heads and seals the ports. Now of course the original gaskets had a plastic carrier; could that be part of the reason for such a low torque? How did the engineers arrive at 132 inch pounds for torquing the lower intake?
Kimberly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2016, 09:19 AM   #2
Senior Member

True Car Nut
 
2kg4u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Windsor, Ontario / Detroit, Michigan
Posts: 4,792
Thanked 215 Times in 176 Posts
2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of
Default

You would have to ask the engineers, but I suspect much higher than that could distort the intake manifold.
2kg4u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2016, 11:36 AM   #3
Senior Member
Posts like a Turbo
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 358
Thanked 18 Times in 14 Posts
Kimberly will become famous soon enoughKimberly will become famous soon enough
Default

Preventing distortion of the intake is done by torquing in steps and following the proper sequence of tightening the bolts.

There are two types of engineering, real engineering and engineering to satisfy the bottom line. Unfortunately, today engineering is the latter. A prime example is the ignition switch on GM cars.
Kimberly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2016, 11:39 AM   #4
Senior Member
Posts like a Turbo
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 358
Thanked 18 Times in 14 Posts
Kimberly will become famous soon enoughKimberly will become famous soon enough
Default

For reference, 132 in-lbs is 11 ft-lbs
Kimberly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2016, 02:11 PM   #5
Senior Member

True Car Nut
 
2kg4u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Windsor, Ontario / Detroit, Michigan
Posts: 4,792
Thanked 215 Times in 176 Posts
2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of
Default

I am a registered professional engineer, and am quite capable of doing the conversion. As far as engineers making errors, I wear a ring on the small finger of my working hand (right) made from iron salvaged from the Tacoma Narrows Bridge as a constant reminder of the potential consequences of errors. If you are not familiar with the context, google Tacoma Narrows Bridge. When my son graduated from engineering I had the honor of presenting him with his ring at his "Calling of the Engineer" ceremony, and it was also made from the same iron. Oddly enough, it is referred to as the iron ring, and every engineer in Canada wears one.

Is there any other wisdom you would like to share about engineers?
2kg4u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2016, 03:52 PM   #6
Senior Administrator


Certified Car Nut
 
Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Elmira, NY
Posts: 15,436
Thanked 927 Times in 736 Posts
Mike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Which torque are you using? American or German?

Seriously, if you are using a cheapo click style torque wrench, they are far from accurate at the lower end of the scale. 11 ft lbs on the average 5-80ftlb wrench isn't good to use.
Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2016, 12:13 PM   #7
Senior Member
Posts like a Turbo
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 358
Thanked 18 Times in 14 Posts
Kimberly will become famous soon enoughKimberly will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2kg4u View Post
I am a registered professional engineer, and am quite capable of doing the conversion. As far as engineers making errors, I wear a ring on the small finger of my working hand (right) made from iron salvaged from the Tacoma Narrows Bridge as a constant reminder of the potential consequences of errors. If you are not familiar with the context, google Tacoma Narrows Bridge. When my son graduated from engineering I had the honor of presenting him with his ring at his "Calling of the Engineer" ceremony, and it was also made from the same iron. Oddly enough, it is referred to as the iron ring, and every engineer in Canada wears one.

Is there any other wisdom you would like to share about engineers?
I am an engineer myself so I can BS with the best of them. Let'* talk about engineering, who was the genius at GM that decided you can put a hot metal pipe in contact with plastic that had a coolant jacket behind it?
Kimberly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2016, 12:56 PM   #8
Senior Member

True Car Nut
 
2kg4u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Windsor, Ontario / Detroit, Michigan
Posts: 4,792
Thanked 215 Times in 176 Posts
2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of2kg4u has much to be proud of
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimberly View Post
I am an engineer myself so I can BS with the best of them. Let'* talk about engineering, who was the genius at GM that decided you can put a hot metal pipe in contact with plastic that had a coolant jacket behind it?
George Schmidt.
2kg4u is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Let it Snow, Let it Snow, Let it Snow GXP Venom Lounge 9 10-22-2008 10:55 AM
let it snow let it snow let it snow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 88bonnsse Lounge 8 12-05-2007 08:51 PM
Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow.. BonneAlien Your Ride: GM Pictures & Videos 37 12-10-2005 12:02 AM
Let's talk Lateral Arms Sol Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning 2 02-09-2005 04:34 PM
Let's Talk Trunks (Booooring!) compyelc4 2000-2005 13 02-28-2004 09:27 PM


Tags
intake torque

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:20 PM.