rear passenger and driver floor getting wet with water?? - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


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Old 01-06-2005, 03:25 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randman1
hi so you appled this rope caulk to all of the plastic molding guards on all 4 doors?, how much did you use? do you put this caulking on both sides on the moldings? also do u apply it to the weather stripping? or just the plastice molding as shown in the pic, also after this do still get any leaks whatsoever?
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Old 01-06-2005, 08:51 AM   #12
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The rope caulk was applied to all of the plastic pieces from bottom of A pilar, up, back & down to the end of the trim at the rear door. I used a little over half of the caulk that came in the box pictured. It has 4 "ropes" together that are peeled apart. I used two full lengths and a little more to finish. The idea was to prevent water from getting into the door seals in the first place so I actually cleaned the existing butyl rubber from the pinch seams. I used mineral spirits which dulled the clear coat somewhat but it gets covered with the door seals anyway.

It'* difficult to say if any water continues to come in. When I had the entire interoir out, it was very easy to see puddles in the floor pans. I still had a small drip on the driver'* side that I corrected before reinstalling the interior. I actually ran water from the hose over the roof with the door seals removed for testing.

If I had to do it over again, and I just might when it gets painted, I would do 2 things different: I would use butyl rubber instead of the rope caulk mostly because it'* black instead of brown and I would apply it in a different spot. The yellow line shows where it is currently and the red line shows where I should have put it.
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Old 01-06-2005, 02:11 PM   #13
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is this butyl rubber like a weather stripping? is it better to use then the caulking?
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Old 01-06-2005, 03:57 PM   #14
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Yea. Butyl rubber is probably what you already have adhereing the door seals to the seam. There was a TSB for interior water leaks. I took this idea and applied my own thoughts to it. The rope caulk works very well and is easy to get but the butyl will blend in a bit better.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interior - Water Leak Into Pass Compartment

Group Ref.: Body

Bulletin No.: 431003

Date: March, 1994
SUBJECT:
WATER LEAK FROM DOORS INTO PASSENGER COMPARTMENT (DIAGNOSE/APPLY SEALANT OR REPLACE DEFLECTOR)

MODELS:
1991-94 BUICK PARK AVENUE
1992-94 BUICK LESABRE
1991-94 OLDSMOBILE NINETY EIGHT
1992-94 OLDSMOBILE EIGHTY EIGHT
1992-94 PONTIAC BONNEVILLE

Condition:

Some owners may comment on water leakage from the door into the passenger compartment area.

Correction:

Diagnose - Water Leak Detection and Location:
1. Unclip bottom of center pillar trim and remove sill plate.

2. Pull back carpet:

a. For front door leak, remove front kick shroud.

b. For rear door leak, remove rear seat.

3. Vehicle must be soaked in a "car wash" type water spray for a minimum of eight minutes.

4. Technician inside of vehicle, during soaking, should use a flashlight to inspect leaking door. Check primary seal bulb for leakage (during test).

IF THERE IS NO WATER ON TOP OF THE PRIMARY SEAL BULB, THEN: (There is water BELOW the primary seal bulb - exiting primary seal carrier to floor pan.)
1. Check for water exiting primary seal carrier to floor pan:

a. At front door - lower pillar at and along rocker panel.

b. At rear door - rocker panel and base of wheel well.

TO REPAIR:

Front Doors -
1. Remove the center pillar trim finish panel.

2. Gently remove primary weatherstrip from upper door opening flange.



3. Apply butyl sealant to front door opening flange starting at the top of the center pillar (Figure 1). Run butyl forward along top of door opening and down front of opening to approximately 10 inches from bottom of door opening.

4. Re-install primary weatherstrip seal to door opening flange. Ensure that seal is fully seated on flange.

5. Re-install the hinge pillar trim finish panel.

6. Re-install the center pillar floor carpet retainer assembly.

7. Re-install the center pillar finish panel assembly.

Rear Doors -
1. Apply butyl sealant to rear door opening flange starting at top of center pillar. Run butyl rearward along top of door opening and down rear of opening. Terminate butyl approximately 4 inches above striker.

Retest after repair.


IF THERE IS WATER ON TOP OF THE PRIMARY SEAL BULB, THEN: (Figure 2):
1. Remove the interior door trim panel as outlined in the appropriate Service Manual.

2. Reposition the water deflector to remove all wrinkles. Add a clear polyethylene tape to assure the water deflector is properly attached to the door. The water deflector must be properly installed to the door or water leaks will persist.

3. If the water leak persists, add the new supplemental water deflector, P/N 25619809 for the front door, and P/N 25619810 for the rear door. These deflectors attach to the bottom three

door trim fasteners. When it becomes necessary to install a deflector on one door, install deflectors on all four doors.
NOTE: If door already has supplemental water deflector, reset both primary and supplemental water deflectors.

Retest for leak after repair.

Parts are currently available from GMSPO.

Warranty Information:

For vehicles repaired under warranty, use:
Labor Operation: T3456

Labor Time: .6 (Inspect/Diagnose)

Add: .1 (Apply butyl sealant, per door)

Add: .5 (Inspect/install deflector, first door)

Add: .3 (Install deflector, per door on remaining 3 doors)

Add: .4 (Retest after repair)
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Old 01-06-2005, 06:01 PM   #15
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where can i buy this Butyl rubber ? does ace hardware have this stuff?
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Old 01-06-2005, 06:49 PM   #16
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That'* a really good question. Ace does have it in a standard caulk tube but it'* rather thinned for use in a caulking gun. I've looked at industrial supply warehouses like www.mscdirect.com, http://www.mcmaster.com/ and www.grainger.com/ but could not find the rope style. I havent looked again since I completed the job with the Ace rope caulk.

I'll do some more searching tonight to see what I can come up with.

EDIT: Here'* what it looks like:
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Old 01-06-2005, 07:51 PM   #17
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OK... these will get you started. The first 3 have butyl rope, or tape as it is sometimes called, but it is way too big for what you need. I suppose in a pinch you could slice it in half but that seems like a lot of unneeded work. The last link is probably the best bet. It appears as if an auto glass installation supplier would be the place to get it in a smaller diameter. As luck would have it, I have a buddy that owns an auto glass business. I'll give him a call tomorrow and find out where to get the stuff. Where are you located? This way I can see if there is anything in your area.

http://shop.store.yahoo.com/cinemasupplies/butyl.html
http://www.press-seal.com/products/*....php?type_id=3
http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/c...ants/48463.htm

http://www.ppgautoglass.com/catalog/cat_marcy.htm
SOLID CORE BUTYL TAPES (084) (MCY)
ME615S BUTYL TAPE, ROUND, 1/4" X 15' Each 6 $2.80
ME815S BUTYL TAPE, ROUND, 5/16" X 15' Each 6 $3.32
ME915S BUTYL TAPE, ROUND, 3/8" X 15' Each 6 $3.60
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Old 01-07-2005, 02:07 AM   #18
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hi iam located in Downers Grove, Illinois
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Old 01-07-2005, 12:29 PM   #19
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Well, my buddy hooked me up with two rolls of the butyl rubber. This opened up many doors to aid in finding some for you. If you do a Google search for "ribbon sealer", oodles of online auto parts and autobody supply stores appear. You can order some from there. Typically, they come in 15' rolls. The 1/4" diameter is really too large so rolling it into a smaller diameter will probably net you 25'. I would suggest getting two rolls though.

While you're at it, you may want to look for some in tape form... thin and about 1" wide. You can make 1" squares and place over all of the screw holes so they will seal too. I will be doing this as well when it comes time to re-do.

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Old 01-07-2005, 12:32 PM   #20
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How do you know his door seals are the source of the leak without water testing first?
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