Piston Rings...? - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


1992-1999 Series I L27 (1992-1994 SE,SLE, SSE) & Series II L36 (1995-1999 SE, SSE, SLE) and common problems for the Series I and II L67 (all supercharged models 92-99) Including Olds 88's, Olds LSS's and Buick Lesabres Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

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Old 08-22-2007, 09:36 PM   #11
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Removing the belt for a bit and starting the engine will not hurt anything. Just don't leave it running for very long as the water pump is not spinning, and the engine can't cool itself.

I too would be very cautious with this mechanic. Unless you just have a completly broken ring floating around in the combustion chamber ( you would know it quickly ) they are not going to make any noise.

You said that you were in for a very needed oil change, were you way overdue, or very low on oil?

Has the noise disappeared since the oil change?

You say that your car runs about 40 PSI oil pressure or less, how much less? It could be that the oil was to low and the oil pump was just not picking up enough oil to lube everything, hence the noise. I would keep a very watchfull eye on the pressure guage.
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Old 08-23-2007, 03:29 AM   #12
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I have not had a chance to pull the belt or anything yet. But I will touch on the barrage of questions.

The belt is a little over a year old, so is the Alternator. They were replaced at the same time.

I was overdue for an oil change time wise, and maybe just mileage wise. The oil level was fine.
The gauge fluctuates almost constantly between the RED and 40. Mostly with the rev, but sometimes it decides to hold steady.

There is no change in the noise since the oil change.

The noise is definitely coming from the BELT-side of the engine.

I am starting to have flashbacks of my alternator repair. I wonder if it is still under some kind of warranty. I doubt it though. I have had a slight voltage surge issue with the new one. Bad regulator or something. It also never reaches the RED, but will randomly surge a volt too many. I have been told that the battery might have a bad cell and this might cause it. But every time I have the thing put on any kind of meter, it runs perfect! It is a FUN time driving my car and guessing which gauge will do what next. I am beginning to wish that I had my brother'* car (I own it). 91 LeBaron Sedan. It is rock solid and not a thing has been replaced but the radiator.

I will listen to the accessories with a screw driver tomorrow morning and post my findings as soon as I get to work. I may not be able to pull the belt until Sunday, though.

I don't want everyone to freak-out. I do have alternate transportation if need be. I have free use of my dead uncle'* truck.
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Old 08-23-2007, 08:12 AM   #13
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Uhm...uh... pssst Deuce... I dunno what you are driving .but 92-99 Bonnie'* don't have smog pumps.

When you head in to listen to the accessories, please pay close attention to the moving belt and pulleys etc. You do not want to touch any of them with anything while moving. Even a slip can hurt for some time.

The safer way if you aren't comfortable around the motor is to pull out the 15mm socket and long ratchet to release tension on the belt and turn the items by hand.
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Old 08-23-2007, 09:10 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillBoost37
Uhm...uh... pssst Deuce... I dunno what you are driving .but 92-99 Bonnie'* don't have smog pumps.

When you head in to listen to the accessories, please pay close attention to the moving belt and pulleys etc. You do not want to touch any of them with anything while moving. Even a slip can hurt for some time.

The safer way if you aren't comfortable around the motor is to pull out the 15mm socket and long ratchet to release tension on the belt and turn the items by hand.
I was going off the top of my head. I didn't go out to look.
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Old 08-23-2007, 11:20 AM   #15
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I took a long screwdriver and listened to everthing on the belt as best I could. The oil change did help to quiet the engine a bit and made it easier to pin point things.

I am sure it is not the alt.making the noise. Not that it doesn't have its problems.

I am 90% sure that the water pump is making the squeaking and ticking. Although the ticking seems to have subsided either on its own, or due to the oil change if is in the engine. Not only could I "hear" the noise with the screwdriver, I could feel it with my hand holding the screwdriver. And the "feeling" was right with the squeaking.

I did notice that it looks as if the pulley on the water pump is "crooked". It looks as if it is bent or loose or something. It sort of wobbles as it turns. And the belt roams ever so slightly across the pulley. Not a lot, but enought o notice if you pay attention.

Which nut(*) do I loosen to loosen the belt? I will try turning things by hand. I don't like the idea of starting the engine without the accessories.
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Old 08-23-2007, 11:26 AM   #16
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Sounds pretty clear to me that your water pump is done for.

Use a 15mm socket and ratchet to release tension on the belt. The tensioner is the ONLY smooth face pulley that MOVES. It'* on a spring-loaded aluminum arm. Put the socket on the pulley center bolt (not the tensioner bolt), and turn it. It will release tension. Carefully examine each pulley, and turn them by hand, including the water pump and AC compressor.

Start the car and run it for a minute or two at most (start cold). How does it sound now? Do not run longer than 2 minutes. You have no water pump without the belt.

This should give you a general idea on the belt removal, in spite of the fact that this is the Series 1 Supercharged engine with two belts:

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Old 08-23-2007, 12:16 PM   #17
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We have actually seen a case or two where a waterpump shaft and bearings were both mangled.
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Old 08-23-2007, 04:12 PM   #18
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I will try that. Like I said, I won't have a chance to really mess with it until Sunday. My little brother is moving for his first year of college so things are a bit hecktic.

Every reference I have found concerning water pupms going bad seems to stress fluid leakage. It is dry as a bone under my car. I just wanted to know if it could fail and not leak. Might be a stupid question to some, so sorry.

Mangled shaft and bearings sounds probable. What would cause that, other than wear and tear.

And finally...
If it is the water pump, how much money would it cost to repair? (remember I am taking it to a shop, not doing it myself.)

***And don't worry, I am not getting it done at the place with the dumb-a** mechanic.
I have a guy that does all my repair work, but he is really busy. He is the one who did the alt., and all the gaskets and repaired my hanging muffler. He is also the one that warned me about the water pump to begin with back in January.

I guess all things point to the water pump, thus far. Thanks for all the feedback!
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