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1992-1999 Series I L27 (1992-1994 SE,SLE, SSE) & Series II L36 (1995-1999 SE, SSE, SLE) and common problems for the Series I and II L67 (all supercharged models 92-99) Including Olds 88's, Olds LSS's and Buick Lesabres Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

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Old 05-14-2008, 04:35 PM   #11
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check the techinfo section off topic what part of the st louis area?
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Old 05-14-2008, 07:48 PM   #12
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Default Use which coolant

I checked the labels on DexCool and the Mixes With Any Type coolants and they have the same 4 ingredients. There isn't any difference anymore that I can tell.Even the label on the front of the Mixes type says 5 years and 150,000 miles just like the DexCool.
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Old 05-15-2008, 03:07 AM   #13
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well I hate dex cool just because of the rumors. I didn't find the torque specs on the tech info . I'm taking a big chance on my engine with all the money I've spent on parts. I want to do it right.
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:46 AM   #14
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Click on: Techinfo, then click on: Specifications and General Information, then click on: Assembly Torque Specs for 87-99 Bonnevilles, under which you will find:

Intake Manifold________________________Ft/Lbs
87-90 Vin 3 (in sequence)..............47
87-90 Vin C (twice, in sequence).......88 (In/Lbs)
Throttle body bolts....................20
91-99 (except 95-97 Vin 1 and K).......89 (In/Lbs, twice, in sequence)
1995 Vin K (twice, in sequence)........89 (In/Lbs)
96-97 Vin K (in sequence)..............11
95-99 Vin 1............................11 and

It is 11 ft-lbs for the LIM, and 7.5 ft-lbs (89 inch-lb) for the UIM.
For throttle body nuts on 6mm studs set into plastic upper intake manifolds, use 7.5 ft-lb.

The tightening sequence starts at the center of the piece, and alternates side to side to the ends. Use blue threadlocker on the bolts for the LIM and the UIM.
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Old 05-15-2008, 10:38 AM   #15
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Default Re: Use which coolant

Quote:
Originally Posted by imidazol
I checked the labels on DexCool and the Mixes With Any Type coolants and they have the same 4 ingredients. There isn't any difference anymore that I can tell.Even the label on the front of the Mixes type says 5 years and 150,000 miles just like the DexCool.
When you go to Prestone.com, you will see prominently displayed "compatible with any coolant" for several of the different types of coolant sold by Prestone, but NOT for Dex-Cool. Many people have been confused by "compatible with Dex-cool" labels on yellow-colored long life (mixes with any color) coolant, thinking that compatible with Dex cool means that it is a new formulation of Dex-Cool. It is not. Dex-Cool sold by Texaco Havoline and by Prestone is orange colored stuff in a silver bottle that is the patented GM formula that many believe has caused so much engine damage.

An identical list of (major) ingredients does not prove that two products are the same or that they are compatible. There could be significant differences in the proportions of ingredients, in the methods of formulation, and there could be proprietary ingredients in the additive packages that are NOT listed on the label. Consider that a label of major ingredients: engine, transmission, wheels, seats, would be identical for a Mercedes and for a Daewoo - they are not the same.

I maintain that unless we know for absolute certain that Dex-Cool has changed its formulation and that the new formulation is compatible with other coolants and that it will not damage engine gaskets when it gets old or is exposed to air, then we should not recommend its use when safe alternatives are available.
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Old 05-15-2008, 10:48 AM   #16
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Mr. Buttermore...you are spot on, as is usual.
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Old 05-15-2008, 12:27 PM   #17
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Default Re: Use which coolant

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Originally Posted by bill buttermore
When you go to Prestone.com, you will see prominently displayed "compatible with any coolant" for several of the different types of coolant sold by Prestone, but NOT for Dex-Cool. Many people have been confused by "compatible with Dex-cool" labels on yellow-colored long life (mixes with any color) coolant, thinking that compatible with Dex cool means that it is a new formulation of Dex-Cool. It is not. Dex-Cool sold by Texaco Havoline and by Prestone is orange colored stuff in a silver bottle that is the patented GM formula that many believe has caused so much engine damage.

An identical list of (major) ingredients does not prove that two products are the same or that they are compatible. that Dex-Cool has changed its formulation and that the new formulation is compatible with other coolants and that it will not damage engine gaskets when it gets old or is exposed to air, then we should not recommend its use when safe alternatives are available.
I'm not sure what the color of the Prestone bottle for Mixes with all Types antifreeze has to do with people thinking it'* a new DexCool. Or am I misunderstanding.

Other other hand if one doesn't feel comfortable recommending DexCool, changed at proper early intervals of 30,000 miles/two years or less, and with the radiator checked to be sure it'* kept full along with the overflow reservoir and the heater core kept free of air bubbles then we shouldn't recommend the Mixes with all Types either. The bottle labels are required to show active ingredients. Another brand shows a proprietary additive on their label because they're required but they don't disclose what it is, e.g. If there were more to the DexCool then it would be disclosed on the DexCool bottle and on the Mixes with all Types bottle.

The hexanoate (ester?) is questioned by some and was discussed in the court testimony as potentially a problem with plastic seals. It is a corrosion inhibitor but also has a plasticizer characteristic and can interact to soften plastics such as the 6/6 seal That same chemical is in the Mixes with all Types.

Early DexCool reported used an oxidation inhibitor (preservative) that was changed and replaced with a more costly ingredient (funny how companies choose the cheaper solution such as MTBE). I am not sure if this is related to the earlier chemical or not. I need to do some rereading.

It looks like both are the same.

After reading the recent postings, although not by chemists, by people in the radiator/coolant business and selected quotes from testimony in the various cases against DexCool/GM, I am considering putting pure green stuff into my 03. I'll leave the DexCool in the 98.
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Old 05-15-2008, 02:56 PM   #18
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should I use rtv on any of the gaskets, I've heard in the corners of LIM, and maybe a small bead. Also, I'm changing the plugs and wires. In your opinions what kind should I get.
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Old 05-15-2008, 04:26 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jberg6
should I use rtv on any of the gaskets, I've heard in the corners of LIM, and maybe a small bead. Also, I'm changing the plugs and wires. In your opinions what kind should I get.
Yes, RTV silicone in the corners where the rail seals meet the gaskets on the heads, and along the rail seals if you like. NGK TR55 plugs, NAPA Belden premium (blue) wires.
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Old 05-15-2008, 04:51 PM   #20
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Default Re: Use which coolant

Quote:
Originally Posted by imidazol
...snip...
It looks like both are the same.
I disagree. I don't claim expertise in coolant technologies. My rationale for recommending "mixes with any color-type", G05 spec coolant is based on a lack of reported problems with that formulation, and a host of problems reported with Dex.

Why would you choose to use Dex, when you could choose to use a product with no known history of problems? What advantages does it provide that are worth the risks of it damaging your engine?

BTW, here in central Iowa, I have not seen the older phosphated green coolant for sale for about two years now.
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