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1987-1991 Parley with regards to your 1987 to 1991 Bonneville, Olds 88 or Buick Le Sabre Please use General Chat for non-mechanical issues, and Performance and Brainstorming for improvements.

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Old 01-19-2006, 02:02 AM   #1
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will a series one TB bolt to a LN3 for better air flow?
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Old 01-19-2006, 02:04 AM   #2
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No. Bolt pattern and plenum diameters are off, and coolant passages won't line up.

Not to mention your MAF sensor can't read the airflow of a larger TB, and your PCM can't read (won't understand) the increased flow of the new TB and MAF. And on and on.

Your car probably can't outflow your current setup until you at LEAST cam the thing or more.
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Old 01-19-2006, 02:59 AM   #3
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thank you, a tuned chip can make the computer understand the change
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Old 01-19-2006, 10:09 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maybe2fast
thank you, a tuned chip can make the computer understand the change
But you have to know the values. So you can buy a 200 AFC controller if you like, but in the long run, your car can't flow more on the top end. So doing all this would be fruitless.
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Old 01-19-2006, 11:11 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maybe2fast
will a series one TB bolt to a LN3 for better air flow?
If the original MAF is reused with a different throttle body, the MAF signal to the ECM will be unchanged. The upper range of the stock MAF is capable of reading air flows into the low 200hp range, so an N/A stock engine will not be able to flow enough to go above the upper range it is capable of. Forced induction is a completely different story. There is a small potential that there will be slight increase in air flow capability, but my flow bench testing indicates the MAF and throttle body are very closely matched from the factory. Testing showed the MAF flow by itself flowed only two CFM more that the MAF-throttle body combination at the same test pressures. The stock throttle body is already slightly enlarged in the area of the throttle blade, probably to compensate for the blade and shaft. The MAF screen makes a much larger difference, over 15 cfm. If the MAF and throttle body are changed together, the calibration will be off, maybe a little, maybe a lot. Ryan and I are working on the same possibilities regarding the larger MAF, but it will be critical to see what the relationship between the stock frequency output is at various airflow rates vs the new MAF to properly adjust the tables. Only time will tell.
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Old 01-20-2006, 12:02 AM   #6
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Thanks, 2seater, but the long and short of it is that this idea on an otherwise stock LN3 would be fun for a Saturday, but of no benefit on Sunday. Sounds like you agree.
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Old 01-20-2006, 11:51 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willwren
Thanks, 2seater, but the long and short of it is that this idea on an otherwise stock LN3 would be fun for a Saturday, but of no benefit on Sunday. Sounds like you agree.
Essentially that is it in a very neat nutshell In general, reducing the intake restriction, will have a small benefit (within limits), but both the MAF and throttle body need to be larger for it to be useful. I know it sounded counterintuitive, but that'* why I built a flowbench to find real data. Some of it surprised me, and even the odd seemingly restrictive stock air box intake on my Reatta was actually a good design, and very efficient. The fliter area was way too small, but the rest of the plumbing actually works better than it appears. A good intake pipe and cone filter IS superior to the stock system.
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Old 01-24-2006, 05:21 PM   #8
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a good piece of pipe and a cone filter on the Reatta was a huge difference on the car
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