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Old 06-16-2003, 03:12 PM   #1
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Default 87 SE wont start

the car will crank up a little lagged, then as soon as i left off the key it dies.
the start up sounds a little rough and it did back fire when i cranked it this morning.
the second time i cranked it, it started fine, but as soon as i let off the key it got very rough, backfired a few times and died.

im figuring it cant be mechanical since the engine starts up in the first place.
it must be somewhere in the fuel system, but what changes?
i've tried reading my service manual, but the fuel delivery section is filled with too many acronyms to learn at once.

im going to start testing fuel system components after work.
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Old 06-16-2003, 03:27 PM   #2
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Hey Dame...Erik (suprrbonne) and I are experiencing the same sort of problem. I'd be very interested to see what you find
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Old 06-17-2003, 03:10 AM   #3
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If the problem item isn't TOO bad off you can probably nail it down to the fuel system. As long as you get a solid 1-2seconds after you start your car you can try this. Turn to key to the full on position and let it sit for 10seconds. The computer should prime your fuel system and put a fair amount of fuel on stand by. Now depress your gas pedal 1/4-1/2 way down and turn it over. Keep the pedal where it stands and turn it over. If the engine runs good if you hold the gas your problem is most likely in your fuel. Still could technically be your ecm but at least you got your ignition out of the way and can start concentrating on things like intake cleaner and replacing your fuel filter.

On the other hand it really does sound like an ecm problem. When you first turn your key your computer goes into a default mode where it puts the exact right amount of fuel and retards the timing several degrees to keep pressure off your starter and make it easier to start. Thats why you don't have to press the gas pedal when you start a fuel injected car as you may have with carburated cars. Neat huh? Your computer does this until both your key is taken off of start and your rpm'* are above a certain level. I believe it was 650rpm'* but that depends on year. Point is this is completely separate from the fuel and timing map it uses when its above 650rpm'*. This would help explain why "the second time i cranked it, it started fine, but as soon as i let off the key it got very rough, backfired a few times and died". If the "run" part of your ecm is fried; after the initial startup phase it will go to the messed up part of the ecm and screw your timing all up and make it backfire and konk out. But like JR said and as I posted up top, try the simple things first.
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Old 06-17-2003, 12:49 PM   #4
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i changed the plugs, that was part of the problem.
now i cam start it, floor it and it will run somewhat.
it has this extreme almost backfire grunt noise the entire time it runs.
the throttle responce is way off and it will cut off after about ~2 sec.
i can keep the car running as long as i am pumping the gas.
soon as i let off it dies.
i need a fuel pressure guage to check that, but as usual the money just isnt here.
i will be getting my new car fri. and i need all i've got for the down payment.

i can pull a ECM out of another H body and put my PCM in it right?
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Old 06-17-2003, 02:45 PM   #5
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just thought i'd mention my starter troubles too, in case they are related.
almost every time the car is started, the solenoid doent engage the first time, the starter motor always turns, but the solenoid seems to be on it'* last leg
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Old 06-17-2003, 03:51 PM   #6
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I love long posts so get out your reading glasses

First off did you check for any error codes? I'm not sure about your year, can it display error codes or do you need a scantool? Umm...about the ecm swap, yes and no. As far as I know you can as long as they're the exact same engine BUT if your engine has one sensor thats not on the engine you pulled the ecm from you could have problems. I'd suggest first trying to reset your ecm. Its free, easy, and who knows it could work out. If you can keep your car running by pressing the gas it really sounds like its pointing at your fuel or air delivery system but its hard to say what it could be especially in a computer controlled car with 30 sensors, it could easily turn out to be a burnt maf sensor or something along those lines. If it happened all of a sudden one day I wouldn't think it would be a dirty fuel injector, unless you threw dirt in there . I've not heard of a fuel injector "going bad" but the possibility is definately there. Start cheap, try replacing your fuel filter, it takes like 20min tops and costs less than $20. It should have gone out slow like your fuel injector would but its cheap enough to just replace for good measure. I had a rough idle and spratic acceleration on mine and just replacing that did wonders. Also just for good measure you should pull the plug from a cyl and see how its doing. Its always best to check them all because each cylinder is like its own little system and can have problems all its own but one cyl may give you an idea on how the rest are doing. You said your getting another car, does that mean your getting rid of the bonnie? I'm curious to see what it turns out to be.
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Old 06-17-2003, 06:58 PM   #7
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i'll check the plug when i go outside, but i just changed them yesterday.
i am buying a 93 SE, and selling this 87SE to my older sister. She sill lives at home and it will be her first car, i wanted her to have to best.
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Old 06-17-2003, 08:39 PM   #8
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plugs are good
SES light on, no codes
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Old 06-18-2003, 12:47 AM   #9
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dubious

my local pull-it junkyard has:
(2) 88 LeSabre'*
(1) 87 98
(1) 87 Ciera
(2) 88 Ciera'*
(4) 88 Delta 88'*
(1) 87 Delta 88

which should work best/be easiest to pull, figuring they all have Vin 3?
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Old 06-18-2003, 01:43 AM   #10
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this wont be a quick repair, the entire sum of my friday paycheck will be part of the down payment on the 93, due friday by 9. So i will be pennyless for a week.... but my next paycheck will have $50 taken out for payments on the 93, the rest is going to fix the 87.. only prob is my paycheck $100-300 depending on hours.... im sleeping up for a 80+ week
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