Whoa, wait a second here. Out of alll the success stories with the APN, what happened here??

In another thread you mention that you will explain what happened in a PM, but because so many of us recommend to others that the APN kit is the best repair option for the UIM, it is really important that we all know what problems there might be, so that we can alter our recommendations accordingly. That really is the purpose of these forums - to get this type of information out to everyone. So, I encourage you to respond publicly to help the greatest number of others with this common problem.

What went wrong with the APN stuff? And why does the LIM need to come off? Does this have something to do with the custom intake listed in your signature?

Apparently, as gojo83 explained in a PM reply to me, the problem was that his APN kit only had one stovepipe, and that pipe only fits 95-98. It must be machined from a base diameter of .749" to .624" to fit in 99 and newer LIMs.

My reply: Until the old stock is gone, it may be a good idea for those ordering APN kits with 99 and newer cars to call to make sure their kit will be shipped with both stovepipes.[EDIT: This is not necessary. All new kits are shipped with two pipes.]

You can go somewhere else, but you won't find a better product for this application. And, you will most likely pay more for it.

The smaller, second APN stovepipe is a very recent (and welcome) development. The first kit we have seen with two pipes was shipped last month. Perhaps we were premature to suggest that all APN kits are now shipped this way, without considering that there might have been some older stock.

To check out this possibility, I called APN (their number is on their website) to inquire if all new 3800 UIM kits were now being shipped with two stovepipes. According to them, they are. They also said that if a piece (like the newer pipe) was missing, that they will be happy to replace it. But, to be fair, they need to know that something is wrong in order to correct it.

Because APN kits are shipped from only one point, we should be able to presume that all new orders will include both pipes.

Apparently, gojo83 purchased his APN kit in December, before they were being shipped with two stovepipes.

Thank you so much for the clarification, Bill.

To add to the information. Recently a Dorman kit picked up by me on the fly for another member did have both stovepipes and more gaskets and pieces as well. These manufacturers are learning and including more in their kits as time goes on. Unfortunately if you get old stock..you get less parts.

I'd recommend doing the lower at the same time as the upper since you already have it apart. The lower is not that much more to do and you might regret it later. Mine lasted until it had 308,000 on it and then it was the upper that started leaking externally. I had known for a while that the gaskets were going because of frequent oil analysis. My lower gaskets were not in good shape either. Surprisingly, my upper manifold was not melted as some I have seen. The stovepipe was almost completely stopped up and I used a new upper plenum and the newer small stovepipe. You won't regret doing both at once.

ok I will give you all a final wrap up. I took the stovepipe to the machine shop and got it all installed. went back home and took the dremel out and smoothed the runners out and took all the area that were not uniform and disrupting the flow. I did not do much in the way of portiing mostly polishing. I will post some before and after pics when I get home but I can defenatily quicker. I was not trying and I spun the tires at a stoplight I couldn't do that before