ZZP list of "bad mods" - Page 2 - GM Forum - Buick, Cadillac, Chev, Olds, GMC & Pontiac chat


Performance, Brainstorming & Tuning Talk about modifications, or anything else associated with performance enhancements. Have a new idea for performance/reliability? Post it here. No idea is stupid! (please use Detailing and Appearance for cosmetic ideas)

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Old 02-01-2004, 02:40 PM   #11
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And the tranny cooler, I won't get into too much in depth, but I have NEVER seen tranny temps higher than ~200*F, and most of the time they stay right around 170-180*F from all the autotap logs I have done on GTP'* & SSEi'*. I have run the Autotap on the GTP for 10 or more runs at the track and when it gets all over with and I go to review the last run of the day after a bunch of hot-laps with no cool down time other than waiting in the staging lanes, the tranny temp will read usually around 175*F or so, WHICH IS BELOW THE OPERATING TEMPS FOR OUR TRANNIES. If we put a tranny cooler on it, the tranny would be running WAY too cold. The operating temps for our trannies is 180-230*F, so I don't think there is any reason to put a tranny cooler on it to put the temps way below operating temps. If your tranny is in the colder part of the operating temps (which I have never seen one that wasn't), then a tranny cooler isn't going to do you any good. Will it hurt it, probably not, but it isn't going to help it any. The only time I would ever put a tranny cooler on one of these cars is if I were going to autocross with the car or something like that when you are beating the crap out of it for long periods of time.
Well Junior, that sound logical but in reality let me teach you a little something about gearboxes and tribology (the study of lubrication) of which I am expertly qualified as a profession engineer in all of its aspects and have over 25 years of industry experience.....seen plenty of sucesses and failures.

Now, gearboxes are a little different in operating characteristics with its bearings, gears and clutch plates than an internal combustion engine which uses journal bearings and sliding surfaces.
The optimum oil temperature for gearboxes is 140* - 160* F.
As soon as you get into a range of 170* - 220*F you progress into a logrithmically increasing degree of danger. That is, the oil must dissapate the heat in order to maintain it'* lubricating properties.

Try holding you hand on a surface that is 140*F. You can't for very long. And you can get scalded by water at 140*F. It'* damn hot enough

Cooler is better.
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Old 02-01-2004, 06:05 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by 2000SilverBullet

Well Junior, that sound logical but in reality let me teach you a little something about gearboxes and tribology (the study of lubrication) of which I am expertly qualified as a profession engineer in all of its aspects and have over 25 years of industry experience.....seen plenty of sucesses and failures.

Now, gearboxes are a little different in operating characteristics with its bearings, gears and clutch plates than an internal combustion engine which uses journal bearings and sliding surfaces.
The optimum oil temperature for gearboxes is 140* - 160* F.
As soon as you get into a range of 170* - 220*F you progress into a logrithmically increasing degree of danger.

Cooler is better.
Then why aren't trannies running at these temps from the factory? Car manufactures would rather have a better reliability rating, then sell you new trannies.
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Old 02-01-2004, 06:48 PM   #13
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well then very interesting
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Old 02-01-2004, 08:33 PM   #14
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In ZZP'* statement they say there are many downsides to a tranny cooler. The only one i got out of their statement is that you can hook it up wrong and a leak could happen. So i guess to prevent this people should check thier fittings to constantly to see if they are still in good shape, and to make sure they install the coolers properly.
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Old 02-01-2004, 08:57 PM   #15
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Car manufactures would rather have a better reliability rating, then sell you new trannies.

You have got to be kidding.
They love to time failures so that parts last only as long as the warranty period.
That'* where they make the big money. :P
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Old 02-01-2004, 09:02 PM   #16
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About the wires, i know changing your ignition wires isn't going to give you much or any hp. I bought a set of MSD 8.5mm wires in bulk and cut them to length myself. The msd wires in my opinion are made a lot better than the stock wires. I noticed that msd and other aftermarket wires are isolated a lot better than stock. So for me the point of getting after market wires was to one, have it look cool, but also to have better isolation between wires to prevent interferances between wires. Also, because after market wires are isolated better they will cause less interferances with other wires under the hood. My dad had a 1994 cutlass 3.4l engine, and he always noticed that when he accelerated he would get interferances with the radio, he would get a buzzing noise that would copy the acceleration, he switched to differant wires and the interferances were gone.
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Old 02-01-2004, 09:26 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000SilverBullet


You have got to be kidding.
They love to time failures so that parts last only as long as the warranty period.
That'* where they make the big money. :P
Some say for the normal buyer the 100,000 mile warranties that GM doesn't have it hurting them a lot. They'll make bigger money selling more cars for reliability, and track records then having LOTS of failing transmissions.
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Old 02-01-2004, 10:26 PM   #18
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Some say for the normal buyer the 100,000 mile warranties that GM doesn't have it hurting them a lot. They'll make bigger money selling more cars for reliability, and track records then having LOTS of failing transmissions.
But from what I have read on this site over the last year, and that'* a relatively small sampling, they do have LOTS of transmission failures....and not just on modified cars.
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Old 02-01-2004, 10:45 PM   #19
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I agree with the list. Alot of the people add it to their cars & actually think they are doing better cause they installed it. Im pretty sure a majority of the people that have tranny coolers dont know what their temps were before or after they installed the cooler. The same thing goes for the wires & coil packs. People think that theyll gain power from changing the wires or the coil packs out. If you have aftermarket parts that are going to need a better spark then itll be to your advantage. Otherwise its like all the FWD ricers out there getting a big wing on the trunk to help with their downforce. Just my 2 cents
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Old 02-01-2004, 11:57 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000SilverBullet
Quote:
Car manufactures would rather have a better reliability rating, then sell you new trannies.

You have got to be kidding.
They love to time failures so that parts last only as long as the warranty period.
That'* where they make the big money. :P
Quote:
But from what I have read on this site over the last year, and that'* a relatively small sampling, they do have LOTS of transmission failures....and not just on modified cars.
I couldn't agree more!
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