Well, we have been looking for a new bonneville for some time now, and we may have found the one, but I think we're getting screwed a bit on the price so we need some advice. I'm gonna give you all the facts I can so this will be a little long.

We got a call from our dealership that they just took in trade a 2002 SSEi that was fully loaded (this thing has everything...onstar, dual heated seats, premium wheels, monsoon sound system, 12 disk changer, moonroof...everything). It is the color we want (black), has 36,000 miles on it (I believe that most cars that age have more like 50,000), and is in very good condition (it even has the original full accessory kit and front plate cover). It has had the steering shaft replaced, along with the front driver side window regulator, and an air bag coil (?), as well as being resealed around the trunk for leakage. It has only been kept with synthetic oil, has a K&N air filter, and has had all regular maintenance done at the correct intervals. It had one owner and he was a real car guy...it hasn't even been cleaned since he brought it in, and yet it is spotless under the hood and inside, and is pretty clean outside (it just rained so it is a little spotty).

We drove it and it was great...I'd forgotten how nice it felt to drive a newish car. Even the torque converter clutch problem we have always dealt with on our car (the shaking and transmission hesistance between 45 and 50mph) doesn't seem to be an issue on this car.

Okay, so here'* the thing...they want $18,900 for the car. According to Kelley, it is only worth $17,970. The dealer uses NADA, which books it at $18,650. So they are still selling it over suggested retail. But here'* the thing...our car (which we will be trading in) has a trade in value of $5,730 according to Kelley, and about $7,500-$8,000 according to NADA, and every dealership we have been to uses Kelley and offered us $5,000 to $6,000 for our trade. They offered us $7,500 for it. We still owe $10,795 on it unfortunately. And it has 91,500 miles on it, so it is really getting up there. It'* been good to us so far (no mechanical work except for work on the torque converter clutch), but for how long?

The interest rate we should be getting is around 6.6%, and the payments would be $419 a month for 5 years. We put about 20,000 miles a year on our cars so we will likely have 136,000 miles on it when we pay it off. If it is good to us, we shouldn't have a problem with it being that high mileage, but if it starts nickel and diming us around 100,000 we could be in for trouble. They offered no warranty but one we'd have to pay almost $2,000 for (24,000 miles, bumper to bumper, $100 deductable). We would have a standard 30 day, $1,000 mile warranty on it though in case it turns out to be a lemon.

What do you think? Should we be pushing for a better deal? I feel like we should, but they seem pretty unwilling to budge. Should we pass it up? Leap on it? We could keep our car, pay it off in 2.5 years, and then get another car, but by then we'll have about 150,000 miles on it. It is starting to show some signs of wear like a thunking when turning (maybe tie rods) and some transmission hesitance at all gears. I'm worried it might be getting ready to do the nickel and diming stuff itself.

Anyone have any tips on talking them down? Do you think we should get the extra warranty?

personally, i would say to stick it out with the 2000, it might not be perfect, but whatever car you buy is going to do the same things with time. Most people get screwed when buying and selling cars because they owe money on it but still want something better (i know from experience) and you will still be paying out the nose for a car that you no longer own because you wanted something a bit better but had to roll over a considerable ammount of money to afford it. the only way to get your moneys worth out of a car is by driving it until its just about dead, or at a minimum, until it is paid off.....

my .02

I like your 2000, white is nicer. (heh)...oh, sorry for parking in your spot on Main Street that Thursday night a few weeks ago

That being said. I was going thru the same thought processes this summer trying to justify selling the Aurora. I ended up keeping it and I'm happy I did.

I would seriously sink your money into a more worthwhile investment. Keep the 2000, take care of it, love it. Wait it out. Even after the trade, its a decent deal on what I am certain is a nice car, but at this point in your lives, is a +$600 monthly (payment, insurance, inevitable maintenance) worth it?

Hmmm...and here I thought everyone here would mindlessly scream "buy it!". :P Yah, I see what you're both saying, and I have certainly thought the same things. It wouldn't be as bad as you said Jim ($370 a month car payment after adding in down payment, $70 a month insurance), but it is still financially smarter to keep the one we have. What to do, what to do...

Hailey, If I had the money I'd quickly give you 4-5K for your current car. There isn't a single problem with it besides the (cough) possible lack of maintenance. And that'* easy and cheap to take care of. Plugs, wires, a pulley and you'd be all set and probably get rid of the feeling at 45-50. (probably a little ignition issue helping out).

Well, I appreciate that, but that is actually less than what the dealers have offered us, and less than what we need. That is why we have decided not to sell it private sale, and why we can't buy a private sale car. We're going to have to stick to dealers I'm afraid, at least until we pay this one off. And we may just keep it and do that...it has been exceptionally good to us. To have a car with over 91,000 miles on it and no repairs at all...I say we got a gem and maybe we ought to hang onto it for just that reason.

We are going to go back today and try to talk them down...just to see where we can get. If they offer us a good deal, I think we might take it, and drop the loan length to 4 years instead of five. That way the value will be more consistant with the payoff, and we won't be stuck in this position next time. If they don't want to meet us at least halfway, we're walking out.

What do you guys think would make it a deal worth going for?

Hailey, start 5k lower than their listed price. I'm not kidding. Act disinterested. You may be surprised how low they'll go. They have plenty of headroom, and I gaurantee they didn't give full trade-in value on the car. They probably gave less than wholesale for it.

I agree with Bill on this. You don't "need" a new car. Yours is working perfectly fine. Therefore they would really need to make it worthwhile for you to consider doing a swap.

personally fron seeing your Car NEBF is looks really good.....unless you want to have a car payment...drive your car.....if you want the 02 like Bill said start lower on the price

We still have a car payment...it'* not payed off. We pay $350 a month now. We can get this car in the same range with a shorter loan if they drop the price. I want them to drop $2000 from it. The problem is that they know we are interested. We can't really act disinterested when we have had them looking for this car for 6 months and they finally found one exactly like what we asked for. :?

The reason we would even consider getting a new car before paying the old one off is only because we drive a car far too much to keep after it is payed off anyway. We are up well into the hundreds of thousands of miles by the time we pay them off (we have done up to 50K miles a year in past years...not so much lately). So it'* really like we are renting cars for the price of our car payment since they are dying by the time we pay them off.

Thanks a lot for the advice though...I really appreciate it. It will help us make our decisions.