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Old 11-12-2007, 02:59 PM   #21
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I'm saying that it is not a gimmick.
I'm saying that Nitrogen molecules ARE larger than oxygen molecules.
I'm saying that Nitrogen filled tires will not leak down and will hold pressure almost indefinitively.
Using Nitrogen to prevent moisture and oxidation is not necessary and will have insignificant effect in an automotive application.

I'm saying that it has benefits............now if those benefits are worth it, depends on the individual and their specific needs.
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Old 11-12-2007, 04:35 PM   #22
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I stand corrected on the molecular size of nitrogen. However, since tires are supposed to be an impermeable membrane, it shouldn't matter that nitrogen is slightly larger than oxygen - neither should pass through. If a tire is leaking enough that it'* low in a week, installing nitrogen is not going to fix it.

I agree that nitrogen is preferred when oxidation is an issue. I thought I stated that. Perhaps I wasn't clear. Oxidation on the internal side of a rim is not a concern in day-to-day automotive use.

Nitrogen still obeys the ideal gas law. Therefore it will not maintain a constant pressure as the tire heats up - that is to say the pressure at 20* will be less than the pressure at 100*.

Using nitrogen in passenger car tires is still a sales gimmick. While there is no detriment, there isn't sufficient gain to offset the cost and inconvenience of using it.
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Old 11-12-2007, 08:16 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSE Motorhead
Nitrogen still obeys the ideal gas law. Therefore it will not maintain a constant pressure as the tire heats up - that is to say the pressure at 20* will be less than the pressure at 100*.
Yes, it does obey the ideal gas law, so it will change it'* pressure over temp.

However, it obeys the ideal gas law a lot better than compressed air with water vapor in it (which isn't an ideal gas at all.) You call water vapor negligable, I dissagree. There is a heck of a lot of moisture inside a tire filled with compressed air...which is exactly why they don't fill aircraft and race tires with it.

As a matter of history, the aircraft industry adopted it first in the 1950'* as more aircraft became equiped with high pressure tires for use on paved runways. Most of the aircraft from the 1940'* were equiped with ballon tires that worked on unimproved runways and took up a lot of space inside the aircraft. Problem, when you take a tire and fill it with compressed air at 120 degrees, then take it up to 30,000 feet where the temp is about as zero as zero can get...it goes flat. Bring it back down from altitude..it will stay flat until it warms back up..which will probably be after you try to land on it..Ooops! Corrosion on the wheels is a mixed bag...a lot of aircraft tires are still equiped with tubes, so corrosion of the rim isn't much of an issue.

Nitrogen works and is worthwhile on a race tire is that contour of the tire is important to the way it handles (even more so on a motorcycle race tire, where a few psi change in pressure can make major handling differences in the bike.) A race tire is also subject to drastic heat changes on a road course...stuff you would never see on a street tire.

On a street car, it is a waste of money.
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