302k miles worth of maintenance
 

As many know I own a 96 SE Bonneville originally owned by my dad and had just over 302k on the car when the original L36 let go. Recently I have pulled the cobwebs off of the car that has been sitting since New Years Day untouched (except for when I moved into my house). I've had an L67 swap on the back burner and am about to start working on it again. I was cleaning out the car yesterday and found my dad's service records, these were current up to 287k when I got the car. Here's a great way to spend $17291.30. Things on this car were fixed before they broke with the exception of the tranny, that's the only thing that left him stranded. All I did to the car was a new set of tires and oil changes and a battery (and a badass system).

Suspension / Brakes
1 set monroe sensa-trac installed 109241 (still on car)
1 spindle
3 alignment
4 set tires
26 rotation / balance
3 brake rotors
5 brake pads
1 brake system flush

Under the Hood
46 oil / filter change
4 transmission / filter change
3 fuel injection cleaning
4 fuel filter
3 PCV valve
4 spark plugs
3 plug wires
1 EGR valve
4 battery
5 air filter
1 uim
2 lim gaskets
3 serp belt
3 coolant flush
1 valve cover gaskets
1 oil pan gasket
1 coolant elbow
1 belt tensioner
1 all coolant hoses
1 ignition coil
1 alternator

Interior / Exterior
3 headlight
2 door molding
2 windshield
2 door lock actuator
2 power window motor
1 fender
1 console armrest

damnnnn

so we will see the L67 at SEBF in a month Right???

That is a long service history w/o a doubt. I see only one alternator replacement in 302k, that's cool. I didn't notice any hub assembly replacements, that's awesome.

Of course, unless something bad happens, I've been trying to get my truck done first, and I think it will be finished in a week or so :twisted:

Wow! Only one UIM replacement, averaging over 150k per manifold!! That's good!

IMO, this is a testiment to why one should perform regular and consistent maintenance and preventive maintenance. Plus it doesn't hurt if you have a real solid car to start with.

Only 4 trans flushes in 302k miles? hmm, i think i know why the trans went out :lol:

I don't know what the interval for the 4T-60e is, but I think its like 20k? So that would have been 15 to date? :lol: :P

Ah, but its good shes still goin! Keep er on the road!

4 trans flushes is 4 more than I would have given it. :lol:

155,000 on my original tranny without a flush yet. IMO, 155K is already a good life span for a 65E. I'm glad I never spent the money to flush it. That's money saved that I can put toward the new tranny...when the day comes.

Proper maintenance can be priceless in most situations. I would consider yourself lucky due to how long your trans has continued with possibly dirty fluid and the additives have probably been used up as well.

I would look at this as a sign of how durable the 65E's really are.... I'm at nearly 166K and putting more power to it daily.

I'll have to look it up and see what's recommended, if anything, but IIRC the normal interval for tranny flushes is normally considered to be 50,000-60,000.

The 4T60 Max interval is like 30,000 miles... 15,000 if its hot weather( severe driving conditions )... On the 60-E it got way better... 50,000 for severe driving conditions or 100,000 for normal conditions... I change mine once a year... And have never flushed any of them... New fluid filter and pan gasket has done them well ;)

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I've done 3 flushes on mine and more recently, a fluid and filter change. If you choose to never flush it, at least drop the pan and change the oil and filter every 15,000 like Don does. Despite the urban myths to the contrary, your transmission, like every other peice of mechanical equipment, likes to run better when kept clean and maintained.

Yes you can have them flushed... And the flush making it fail is a myth... Keep the trans clean and it will stay happy for a long time to come.. ;)

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its not a myth. sometimes the shitty fluid is keepin everythin runnin good. a friend flushed his gtp and it went out within a week

Your friend flushed because he was having problems. Total loss was inevitable.

nooooooo he flushed it cuz he was in the AT class and just learned how to use a flusher. it had been fine up to that.

A properly performed transmission flush will NOT make your transmission fail. It MAY bring about the impending failure of a damaged trans quicker, but that is the extent of that. Do not perpetuate the myth.

Do you really believe that it is a recommended maintenance procedure in your owner's manual because the OEM's want your transmision to fail?

By that same logic, one should never perform a Coolant flush or an Engine Oil flush either.

Transmission fluid is a lubricant with additives, just like other lubricants in your car. The additives break down over time and wear particles from the engine/trans components build up in your system. Thus, if you want your car to last longer than average, you regularly change these lubricants and refresh them with new, while flushing out the wear particles that can cause damage to your components. Anything less reduces the lifespan of your vehicle, no matter what voodoo you chooe to believe in to justify doing otherwise.

Why do you think there is a magnet inside the bottom of the trans pan?


True story:
A past neighbor of mine never checked or replaced engine oil or filters in the multiple Camaros he owned over a period of years. Each one eventually blew the motor after a few years. He felt that this was normal and would just get another used Camaro. When I asked him why he didn't ever change the oil, he said that it was unnecessary and a waste of money. The Camaros were "cheap enough".

He had no basis to believe this other than a friend of his had told him this when he owned his first car. No matter what I told him, he wanted to believe it. Do you believe it?

thats all well and good, but my info came from an ex ford tranny specialist. so im choosing to believe him and the proof i have.

Cool...treat your motor oil the same way then. Trans fluid has recommended change intervals just like engine oil. When you finish changing both because you blew them... c'mon back and we'll help you understand how oil gets dirty and why you can listen to a different manufacturer all you want.

haha, i started a snowball of a transmission discussion.. :lol:

I definitely believe in clean fluids. And Flushing is the best because it keeps the transmission clean! Even just draining and replacing the filter isint GREAT, but its better than just ignoring it altogether!

But umm, how come the THM-440T4 requires a change of 15k and then the 4T-60e requires much less? Where did they go wrong with the THM-440T4? Does it just get too hot?

Eh I will just keep at a 15k mile interval flush and filter and we shall see how long it will last.

Are there any people here who have a car with a THM-440T4 and have owned it since new and flushed and replaced the filter every 15k? Im wondering how long one of these actally can last!

i never said to not flush ur tranny nor did i imply it. i simply stated that flushin the tranny could and did cause failure in a 4t65-hd.

And I'm simply asking if you are willing to do the same with engine oil. Basically the same type of system. There is a filter and a way to change both because they wear and the additives break down. ;)

Not to beat this thing to death, but I'm going to have to repeat my question to you. Do you believe that the flush truly caused the failure or did it merely expose an already failing/weak transmission.

Second, the "proof" you have is a friend who's transmission failed after he flushed it. You do know that there is a right and wrong method to flushing the transmission, right? Like anything else done incorrectly, a trans flush done wrong can cause damage. That does NOT mean, however that flushing itself causes damage.

For your proof, was a diagnostic breakdown done on the failed transmission? What did they find to be the actual failure mode? How did that relate to the trans flush?

Now, before you get mad at me, understand that I'm not trying to pick a fight or prove you wrong or anything. It's more important to me that we make sure that we, as a club, do not pass on mis-information if we can possibly avoid it.

An educational thing I did, was to spend some time researching the subject, both on the web and through some good old-fashioned reading. I encourage anyone to do the same. More information is better than just a little.

So, in the interest of presenting both sides..

There have been rare cases where a transmission flush has been determined to have "caused" a trans failure. Those incidents were attributed to one of two causes

1) Seasoned mechanics will often refuse to flush a trans that has severely burnt fluid or that has never been flushed or had a filter change with many miles on the vehicle (100,000 plus). The given reasons are twofold.

A. Severely burnt or dark brown fluid is no longer doing its job. The additives are not cleansing the system and there is likely already damage. A flush in this case could dislodge large damage particles that move and then do further damage. This transmission was going to fail anyway, but it's demise was hastened.

B. Many of the valves and passages in your trans have very small passages in them. A transmission with many miles on it that has never been flushed will have "collections" of deposited wear particles that have settled in lower flow areas (there is a magnet in your trans pan that is designed to catch the normal wear particles, but excess will find it's way elsewhere). These sediment areas can break off in chunks and lodge in a small passage, causing fluid blockage and possible damage.

2) Apparently, there are shops that lazily don't do a transmission flush correctly or do not use the correct equipment. In this case the actual flush can damage seals, according to some articles I read. This is NOT the case for shops that use modern equipment and trained techs, though. This item is the one I read the least about and I did not research it any further to understand completely why this occured.

The bottom line is that both Manufacturers and Dealers include regular flushes and or filter and lube changes as part of regular maintenance.