Crazy Climate Control SWAP... UPDATE!
 

OK fellas... I want to know how hard it would be to replace my old three-knob climate-control with an electronic unit. Does the ECC for a 1994 still control with vacuum lines like the three-knob unit does? I realize i would need a couple extra sensors, and some heavy duty install time. But what sensors are required and would it be imposible because of the vaccuum line control on the curent unit?

I want to to this because i have a project coming up that will require me to modify the dash to the point i will probably need to move the climate control to a different location, and with the ECC i will be able to control it with smaller switches once i modify it. (I feel i am electronically advanced enough to do this)

Thanks!
Brandon

you will need alot of differet parts. There is the sensor that is in the middle of the windshiels to tell the temp, there are outside temp sensor. and the vacuume lines are not there on a ECC

Thats unfortunate. I was really hoping it had some sort of electronic vacuum control, but i figgured it would not. Does it then control the flow with motors?

Im not giving up yet... if i can find an ECC off a junked 94 then ill probably still want to do a conversion, just because im running out of dash space fast, and i dont have a console to move things too.

OK, so i got home and reffered to my Bonneville Bible (Yes i have a brand spanking new 1994 Bonneville Factory Service Manual, so anyone with a 94 in need of serious help that Chiltons cant give, ill help you out) And this doesnt LOOK all that hard except for the dissassembly.

My first basic need is a 1994 SSE very cheap (prefferably without engine or trans) or at least to find one at my local "U Pull and Save" junkyard that i can trash for parts. (Maybe even with HUD ;-) )

It requires a few extra sensors and the ECC Programmer Unit (that DOES control the vacuum solenoids) and the head-unit for control. I got all that from a quick browsing of the schematics. f anyone wants to beat me over the head and say im insane, please be my guest. It only requires like one connection to the PCM (AC request) since the actual ECC unit controls everything else.

Let me know what you all think, or if you have experience to help me out / bring me to reality.

On 97-03 Grand Prix's it's near impossible. The 3 knob works conventionally, while the ECC systems used encorporate actuators to move the ducts. These actuators aren't in the Knobbed cars.

I am very curious to see if our cars are the same way, or if they're just diferent in wiring, and some of these sensors.

Hit me up if you need parts, I have most of a 94SSE in my shed. I think I have everything but the CC head, none of the wiring tho.

Well i know from looking in my manual that both the manual and the ECC systems use vacuum-actuators to move the ducts. Heres ehat i have found so far:

ECC vs Manual

-ecc vacuum lines goto a climate control programmer (a PCM for the air conditioning) instead of direct to the panel as on the manual versions

-ecc has an internal and external temperature sensor

-the ecc might also require a sensor on the evaporator and heating coils to sense for moisture that has condensed (doesnt seem necessary, just a creature comfort thing so you dont get water blown all over you if it has condensed)

-ecc has steering wheel control inputs, i dont have the steering wheel controls, seems to me to be not a problem to not hookup

Thats what i can remember off the top of my head... only the first two seem necessary

"Hit me up if you need parts, I have most of a 94SSE in my shed. " - only on Bonneville Club. com
I might need some parts, thanks Dame, howabout the programmer module you have that burried somewheres? (You said you dont have the ECC faceplate right?)

I wondering the exact opposite... How hard would it be to install a 3 knob unit in place of an electronic climate control on a 95 SSE? I've had so much trouble with my ECC throwing codes and not responding that I would be thrilled with the manual version at this point. Is it as simple as swapping units, or how involved would it be

The most difficult part of swapping the other direction is to extend the vacuum lines to reach the main unit... if you do it can i have your temp sensors? :lol: But i dont want your main unit if it keeps throwing codes :P

You are going to have many sleepless nights my friend.. Both of you.


-justin

Dude, If you can find the parts, It's simple.

I've got the vacuum control head and the vent assembly within easy view. But the scrapyard pulled the part you actually touch with the buttons and stuff before I got the car.

aaaaand thats different from any other night how? :shock: :lol:

Meh it doesnt seem THAT hard like Dame said... just gotta know where to find the parts in the car... then get them from a junker.

Yes, this is true, however.. it's not just going to piece together. You will need to put forth a lot of effort, and it's just not going to be easy. When I look at my FSM, I see there is a very large difference between Climate Control and Manual.


-justin

That controller,

you said it was like a PCM for the air conditioning right? I have a 95 SSEi and I am having a world of trouble with my heat right now, as there is none. One of the actuators isnt funtioning and I...well...am without any heat at all. How tough is it to get to the controller and where can I get one? it may be the actuator itself, right?

Thanks

Anyone that would read this thread have access to a cheap ECC headunit and programmer off an SSE or SSEI that worked decently well.. (prefferable right at year 1994)

I am going to dive into this project headfirst since i have a job...

So i had a fun day today! I found a boneyard bonneville (about 94 i think) and i stripped it down to the firewall in search of the ECC programmer unit. Well i found it and got the button control unit and programmer unit. (Grand total $22) It took me under two hours.. impressive for a first time i thought.

The reason i bought this unit was because i am installing a screen in my dash and will not have room for the climate control, so i wanted it to be automatic. And i was planning on stripping the faceplate down to just a screen and rewire it to use buttons that i can install. Basically compacting the unit and reinstalling it in the dash with its smaller footprint.

First thing i did when i got it home is dissassemble it. I went through the FSM and found what each of the 15 wires went to (except one that still evades me... its not in the manual) I can do most of everything that i wanted to it will just require some work. The only things i forsee a problem with right now is:

- Need a blower control module... the manual only has a relay and some resistors... most likely found at the junkyard with the bonneville already disassembled.

- there are two connections to the PCM that probably dont exist on my car, and even if the connectors were there the PCM is proly not programmed for it (one of those is compressor request.. it almost has to be there.. just need to find it)

- i need the solar heat, ambient(external) temperature, and internal temperature sensors. (Dame?)

- The internal temp sensor had duct hooked up to have air flow over the sensor that ran back to the main blower unit(i need that too). Mine proly wont have a spot for the hose.

Theres more to it but i cant think of it right now... I have a million peices of electronic climate control on the desk in front of me

the external temp sensor in in the middle of the dash right by the windshield, and the internal temp sensor is right next to the cigarret lighter

Not correct. The external temp sensor is mounted to the front radiator support outside. The sensor in the center of the dash (little dome) is the solar radiation sensor. Not a temp sensor. The interior temp sensor is correct. It's behind the little grille in the dash next to the lighter.

Is the External Temp Sensor the same for me? I have been looking for that bugger for a long time.


-justin

Yours is in the same general location, Justin. In front of the radiator and behind the grille. It sits a little lower in the 92-99 cars.

Ya know I've been wondering wtf that thing was :oops:

AHA! thats excellent :-)... now i need to go swipe new sensors (i already had the solar and internal temp sense. i just dont know if they still work the way they should....) anyone willing to pull some for me off of a parts car with ECC (93-97 i assume will work) that they own?