Gtech vs Reality (track)....again VERIFIED....new data!
07-27-2004, 02:46 PM
#13
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I don't know if Bill'* car is the same, but I've noticed really bad KR at high ambient temps. Pulling in outside air didn't help. This is where some sort of water injection or intercooling would be great. Here we have 100*+ temps at 80% humidity.
07-27-2004, 06:30 PM
#16
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I was hoping you'd pipe in here, Kyle.
I just spent the day doing cold and hot accellerometer calibrations in the lab. Controlled temp environment, and granite blocks and squares for consistency. We'll see what tonight brings
I'm settin the car up exactly as I had it at Woodburn before I leave work in about 10 minutes. I'm carrying the same amount of fuel, but it'* 10° cooler ambient, without high track temps. I'm expecting quicker times without putting the car in 'track trim'.
Perhaps the lower octane I'm running will make up for the lack of heat? I should have less KR, so it might be a wash.
I just spent the day doing cold and hot accellerometer calibrations in the lab. Controlled temp environment, and granite blocks and squares for consistency. We'll see what tonight brings
I'm settin the car up exactly as I had it at Woodburn before I leave work in about 10 minutes. I'm carrying the same amount of fuel, but it'* 10° cooler ambient, without high track temps. I'm expecting quicker times without putting the car in 'track trim'.
Perhaps the lower octane I'm running will make up for the lack of heat? I should have less KR, so it might be a wash.
07-27-2004, 06:35 PM
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Mine came with the accelerometers pre-calibrated so one possible problem was prevented there. Make sure you calibrate the G'* to your car before running any times. To do this you need to calibrate your rpm'*, weight, redline, etc etc...but then run it with NO tree, NO rollout, NO nothing. Then when you stage it should bring up that horizontal bar tach and say "Launch when ready". Give her come moderate acceleration, but don't go all out. After a decent acceleration to roughly 40mph let off and push the "ok" button to stop the G-tech from gathering anymore data. This is how you calibrate the G'* to your car and provides accurate numbers. I go through this procedure quite often to ensure accuracy.
07-27-2004, 09:08 PM
#18
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Will were there scales available for your use @ woodburn? Next time you're there check it out for sure. No SSEi of that vintage was with us to weigh in, so we don't have any weight for you to program in.
I did share an idea with kyle, maybe one of you guys could pass it on to G-tech if you think it would help. Have a Mode in the G-tech where you run the 1/4 mile and the input your time, so then it backtracks and figures out the equations it needs. Input what you ran, and it adjusts accordingly.
But everyone i've ever talked to who has an aftermarket accelerometer says keeping it adjusted is very important. Once perfect it'll record just right.
I did share an idea with kyle, maybe one of you guys could pass it on to G-tech if you think it would help. Have a Mode in the G-tech where you run the 1/4 mile and the input your time, so then it backtracks and figures out the equations it needs. Input what you ran, and it adjusts accordingly.
But everyone i've ever talked to who has an aftermarket accelerometer says keeping it adjusted is very important. Once perfect it'll record just right.
07-28-2004, 12:32 AM
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And it did. Many thanks to Kyle....(but I'd already re-calibrated just gave me the confidence boost to stick with it over 7 runs today).
From another topic, today'* results:
just gave me the confidence boost to stick with it over 7 runs today).From another topic, today'* results:
And I'm back in the 14'*.
Spent quite a bit of time out with the Gtech today, mainly because conditions were EXACTLY like Woodburn, and I just re-calibrated the Gtech this morning. I figured if I went out there in the same conditions, that sucker BETTER repeat. And it DID. I was running lower octane fuel, but the rest was the same. 92-94 degrees, almost a half tank of gas. All the junk in the trunk. Front tires down to 28, ELC tricked, high speed fans on, with a 2k preload in performance shift. Turned a 15.9 @ 87.26 and a 15.734 @ 88.5, back to back. Very frustrating, so I ran again with the scantool hooked up. Guess what? 5° of KR, and the KS counter was going nuts. My timing was killing me.
The main purpose was to determine if the Gtech would read close to my track times (15.5, 15.6) in the same conditions, and it did, with my slower times being indicative of the lower octane.
The second reason I ran today was that I believe my shift points were too high. My PCM is shifting me in performance mode too far out of the peaks. To confirm this today, I let the car cool down while diagnosing my boss'* bad coupler on his 95 Riviera SC. After I left his house (car still ELC tricked), I let the tires down to 25 from 28, dumped some Toluene in the tank (enough to put me over 96 octane, and stripped the trunk and back seat. Left everything sitting by the side of the road!
Set the car up in NORMAL shift, and pulled a 14.932 E/T. I didn't have any more time to run (btw, the weather had cooled to 90° by this run), but I had 0KR. Out of gas, I just got home.
It seems in performance shift, with the Jet programming, I was shifting too far out of my power band. Including all 4 runs at Woodburn. It was killing me the whole time. I'm assuming Jet didn't program for performance/normal shift modes. The programmed their optimum shift points in NORMAL mode, with perf mode being even higher than that.
I'll contact Jet and try to figure this out. Coincidentally, this puts me within 2 tenths of my best Gtech run last year (14.7) in cooler weather. I had forgotten to put it in performance shift that time
Spent quite a bit of time out with the Gtech today, mainly because conditions were EXACTLY like Woodburn, and I just re-calibrated the Gtech this morning. I figured if I went out there in the same conditions, that sucker BETTER repeat. And it DID. I was running lower octane fuel, but the rest was the same. 92-94 degrees, almost a half tank of gas. All the junk in the trunk. Front tires down to 28, ELC tricked, high speed fans on, with a 2k preload in performance shift. Turned a 15.9 @ 87.26 and a 15.734 @ 88.5, back to back. Very frustrating, so I ran again with the scantool hooked up. Guess what? 5° of KR, and the KS counter was going nuts. My timing was killing me.
The main purpose was to determine if the Gtech would read close to my track times (15.5, 15.6) in the same conditions, and it did, with my slower times being indicative of the lower octane.
The second reason I ran today was that I believe my shift points were too high. My PCM is shifting me in performance mode too far out of the peaks. To confirm this today, I let the car cool down while diagnosing my boss'* bad coupler on his 95 Riviera SC. After I left his house (car still ELC tricked), I let the tires down to 25 from 28, dumped some Toluene in the tank (enough to put me over 96 octane, and stripped the trunk and back seat. Left everything sitting by the side of the road!
Set the car up in NORMAL shift, and pulled a 14.932 E/T. I didn't have any more time to run (btw, the weather had cooled to 90° by this run), but I had 0KR. Out of gas, I just got home.
It seems in performance shift, with the Jet programming, I was shifting too far out of my power band. Including all 4 runs at Woodburn. It was killing me the whole time. I'm assuming Jet didn't program for performance/normal shift modes. The programmed their optimum shift points in NORMAL mode, with perf mode being even higher than that.
I'll contact Jet and try to figure this out. Coincidentally, this puts me within 2 tenths of my best Gtech run last year (14.7) in cooler weather. I had forgotten to put it in performance shift that time
07-28-2004, 12:49 PM
#20
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Ok.....after last nights 14.9, I set out to prove it again this morning. Cold tires (bad launches) and the junk in the trunk re-installed. Same Octane, but a bit heavier.
Turned a 15.3 and a 15.1 back to back. In the next chart, the white and red runs were duplicated track and car conditions from Woodburn. Came VERY close to my timeslips all around, including trap speed. Then I discovered the 5° of KR and the fact that normal shift performs better than performance with my Jet. The green and blue runs were made this morning on the way to work with the cold tires and 200-300 pounds in the trunk. 15.3 and 15.1 with crappy 60' times. Pretty interesting comparision. The G graph shows how much harder it was pulling this morning.
Left 2 runs-Woodburn setup and conditions, 90-94°, ELC, 28psi, 92 octane Right two runs-normal shift, ELC, 25psi, cold tires, 96+octane, 25psi
It'* pretty obvious that the car will get back into the 14'* at the track the next time around. This round with the Gtech I got very similar results to the track, Just as Kyle did with his. Almost identical. The trick is having a track run to compare to after spending the time to calibrate. You HAVE to have a good standard for comparison to be able to trust the Gtech.
Turned a 15.3 and a 15.1 back to back. In the next chart, the white and red runs were duplicated track and car conditions from Woodburn. Came VERY close to my timeslips all around, including trap speed. Then I discovered the 5° of KR and the fact that normal shift performs better than performance with my Jet. The green and blue runs were made this morning on the way to work with the cold tires and 200-300 pounds in the trunk. 15.3 and 15.1 with crappy 60' times. Pretty interesting comparision. The G graph shows how much harder it was pulling this morning.
Left 2 runs-Woodburn setup and conditions, 90-94°, ELC, 28psi, 92 octane Right two runs-normal shift, ELC, 25psi, cold tires, 96+octane, 25psi
It'* pretty obvious that the car will get back into the 14'* at the track the next time around. This round with the Gtech I got very similar results to the track, Just as Kyle did with his. Almost identical. The trick is having a track run to compare to after spending the time to calibrate. You HAVE to have a good standard for comparison to be able to trust the Gtech.