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Old 02-22-2007, 12:53 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by willwren
Not sure where you're coming from on this Hans. An APN or improved Dorman or Dillon UIM should be a LIFETIME part. Not 3 years. We're talking about a solution to the problem here, not a band-aid.
Originally Posted by Hans
The aftermarket and even oem UIMs should last the life of the least 3-5 years.
I never mentioned dilion did I?. With the dilion intake modified sleeve design they should last forever, the design flaw is eliminated.

Keep in mind dorman intakes DO NOT carry a warranty whatsoever, at least they dont carry a warranty thru autozone or advance.

From the experience of this board most members experience problems with the UIMs when the vehicle is older, generally over 5 years, thats a general figure but try a search on the recent threads regarding UIM failure and you will see this generally occured on higher miliage older cars. the symtom clearly takes time to show and its not an overnight failure.

The point I made is that WHATEVER intake you choose (aka dorman or oem or whatever), it should last AT LEAST 3-5 years without any problems, It could last 20 years for all I know. Several L36 cars do not have the UIM problems while the car that rolled out of the assembly line right after it has had the UIM go twice, once at 70,000 miles, once at 180,000. I'm pulling these numbers out of my rear but I've read A FEW threads where others have had the OEM intakes fail TWICE. What about EK98? didnt he have problems with the UIM and it was a replacment?

Originally Posted by BillBoost37
A high quality torque wrench is not needed. A reasonable and good working wrench will do fine. The two torque values you will need to be concerned the most with are 89inch lbs aka ~8 ft lbs and approximately 13-20ft lbs. Any indication of quality needed, I bought a ~$20 Harbor Freight special for the low values.
Thats good advice and what I was getting at, if you have an inch-lb torque wrench you'll be ok, If you had a 0-80lbs cheapo harbor freight like I have, I would not trust it to be accruate at the low end, harbor freight'* website shows it can be 4% inaccurate. Inch lb wrenches are much more accruate but cannot do the heavier duty stuff. Therefore if all you have is a cheapo 0-80ftlb generic torque wrench with 5lb clicks and 4% inaccuracy its not trustworthy. Again this was an opinion. Like you I'm entitled to my own opinions.

Originally Posted by BillBoost37
Instead of buying a shop vac, most of us that work on cars would recommend draining the coolant before starting the procedure. This single thing will save the cost of a shop vac.
Click the image to open in full size.

Notice something liquid in the picture, thats not coolant, thats oil...what I meant to say, I suppose you could just use a shop towel or paper towel to clean that up but I was thinking shopvac would be more fun. This is what we used on my friends 97 GP when we did the LIM gaskets and UIM. Yes we drained the coolant first. It is a matter of personal preference, the shopvac is also helpful for cleaning out the crap sitting on top of the LIM as well....Of course compressed air and a shop towel will do the exact same purpose. One other thing:

Click the image to open in full size.

Wouldnt a shopvac be the easiest thing to use to get that dexcool crap out of there? Again dont go out and buy a shopvac if you dont have one already but if you have one laying around I say go for it.

Originally Posted by BillBoost37
For the time and effort, aim for the best costing and best parts you can get. Why settle for 3 years (which is unrealistically low IMO)? Fixing this properly and before it is necessary will keep this car on the road for years to come. By changing out the EGR stovepipe and sleeving the wall, cracking of the coolant/egr passages should not be an issue in the future.
Obviously the Dilion modification sounds like the absolute best option, I'd reccomend this anyday over a dorman or OEM plenum. I dont have personal expereince with it but the idea is a good one. There has yet to be a failure with one of the dilion intake modification at this point in time so it appears that it fixed the issue with the plenum cracking. But is a dilon really needed? how long is the car going to last? shouldnt a dorman work just fine? You yourself said 3 years is low for a OEM/aftermarket intake to last... I do agree with you, if you want it to last forever do the modification with the smaller diameter stovepipe, if you want it to last at least another few years (few years = 3-20 years) go aftermarket or oem. The peace of mind of actually fixing the problem instead of a bandaide is more favoritable in my opinion.

In the future I will try to explain in more detail what I'm trying to say.
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Old 02-22-2007, 07:19 AM   #22

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Originally Posted by Hans
In the future I will try to explain in more detail what I'm trying to say.
Please do, your posts up to this point have seemed misleading and inaccuarte. That coming from a Gearheads and Admins that have personally reviewed, tested and completed this procedure on many vechicles. If we know about this, what will the newer members thoughts be when reading it? Do you plan on being responsible for misinformation and someone having car trouble after following your advice?

To add to what you've said. The Dillion is not the only good solution intake, there are others. However in your backpedalling it appears you indicate only the Dillion is good because it was left out by you originally. Also the time issue, your post makes this seem as though the new intake will only last 3-5 and your reply to WillWren seems to be based off the original intake. Facts are facts and as a gearhead and oen that has actually done this work on cars, I'd like to suggest that people looking at this thread do not rely on any information you provided in it. There are simply too many holes and problems with it.

The shop vac idea seems to make more work that it saves. If you vac up that oil, then you need to clean the hose, attachments and the rest of the shop vac all the way through, since you gooped it with oil. A conventional rag will soak that oil up quickly and go right in the trash.

Torque wrench.. I'm using a cheap Harbor Frieght for this stuff. 4% is 4% at 3lbs or 100lbs. A reasonable wrench that will give you a decent accuracy is all that is necessary. A high quality torque wrench is out of most peoples price ranges unless they work on cars for a living. To give you a basis for understanding, the $80 Craftsman or Husky wrenches I own are considered good quality, not high. And the Harbor Frieght is fine, afterall... torquing is more about a consistency than it is the exact value.

On that blocked port and using a shopvac. Put a rag in the lifter valley and clean your gasket surfaces. All that will clean right up. There'* no need for a vac here.
00 Regal GS: All kinds of cool stuff.

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Old 02-22-2007, 10:05 AM   #23
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To clarify:

A NEW OEM UIM will last longer than 3-5 years if you keep your car maintained and check your fluids, refresh/flush when needed, or purge the DEX and run a cooler thermostat.

The Dillon UIM (the most bulletproof of the 3 options in my opinion), the IMPROVED Dorman (not the design from last year) and the APN should all 3 be lifetime improvements. This is assuming you follow our well-founded advice on how to install and what other items to take care of at the same time.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:08 AM   #24
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Here are my recommendations for UIM/LIM repairs for the 95-05 L36.

Please note that if you cannot wait for parts in the mail, you will not get the best fix.

The best fix for the LIM - GM aluminum frame gaskets......$59
The best fix for the coolant elbow(*) Dorman Help.........$6
The best fix for the UIM - APN upper intake manifold kit......$115 including shipping

In addition, I recommend the following steps to keep engine operating temperatures down, to ensure that coolant flows around the hot stovepipe area in the plastic UIM, and to eliminate any possible harm from the use of Dex-cool - all factors that protect and extend the life of the UIM and LIM gaskets.

Flush coolant and re-fill with "mixes with any color"
Drill a 1/16" hole in a 180F thermostat flange and refill according to:
Install an after-market transmission cooler.

I use only a scraper and degreaser to clean gasket surfaces on the cylinder heads to avoid introducing abrasives into the engine.

Regarding the UIM, the longest-lasting fix will come from an upper intake manifold protected by a heat shield and the use of a reduced diameter stovepipe to provide an insulating gap between the hot stovepipe and the metal heat shield. The only commercially available kit that provides those features is from APN. Dorman UIMs have NO heat shield protection for the plastic EGR bore, but rely solely on the insulating gap provided by a reduced diameter stovepipe.

UIMs can be sleeved, plugged, and otherwise repaired for re-use, and these repairs can be made at low cost. But, unless the UIM is fairly new, most will typically exhibit warpage at the throttle body sealing surface and at the coolant passage sealing surfaces around the EGR bore. When considering repair of a UIM, don't forget to add the costs of a new UIM-LIM gasket and throttle body gasket, typically about $45.

From Sears, a smaller 3/8" drive deflecting beam type torque wrench does just fine for UIM/LIM work. It costs $25.

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Old 02-23-2007, 07:30 AM   #25
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I will do what I can, thanks to everyone for the helpful info!
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Old 02-23-2007, 09:53 AM   #26
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And Rachel, don't hesitate to take up some of the Ohio members on their offers to help you do this. That'* one of the benefits of being a member of a least if there is someone in your area anyway.
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