Ken-Co Repair Kit for Intake
03-16-2005, 09:57 AM
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Ken-Co Repair Kit for Intake
I decided to post this to make it easier for others to find the info for ordering one. I had to spend an hour this morning searching this forum to find the info buried in another 5 page long thread. So here it is.
Ken-Co Industries Upper Plenum & Lower Intake Repair Kit
http://ken-co.com/manifold/default.htm
You can purchase the kit from Gagnon Auto and RV. They are a GMC dealer. The phone number is 1-800-498-3350. The price is $80 shipped in the US
I strongly feel that this is an essential upgrade for the 95+ Bonneville. This is the right way to prevent the problem from happening again. I don't think my car has the upper intake leak yet but since my lower intake is leaking I am going to have this installed at the same time. Plus I will feel confident that I won't need a new upper intake in 20,000 miles.
One note is that the upper sleeve from the Ken-Co kit for the upper intake does not seem to fit into the Dorman replacement intake being sold on Ebay and local parts stores. The Dorman hole seems to be a 1/8" too small for the Ken-Co kit. The lower intake manifold stove pipe in the kit should still work fine however and will be better than keeping the OEM stovepipe in place. I strongly feel that if you need a new intake you would be better off with a new GM upper manifold part #89017272 and then also install the Ken-Co kit or a new GM lower intake manifold with the new smaller diameter stove pipe and you won't need the Ken-Co kit.
The GM part# 89017272 upper manifold is $135 from GMpartsdirect.com
The GM part# 24508923 lower manifold is $167 from GMpartsdirect.com
The Ken-co Kit is $80 from Gagnon Auto
For those wondering, it seems that GM redesigned the lower intake in 2000 or 2001 with a new smaller diameter stove pipe. The part number for 1995-2004 has not changed but the replacement parts are rumored to have the smaller diameter stove pipe installed in them. To bad we don't know how to identify the changeover on the outside of the lower intake before it is all taken apart.
All this information I have provided is not from firsthand experience. I have simply been trying to piece together all the info i have been able to find from other peoples experience. The biggest question is what change was made to the new GM upper intake part# 89017272? Will the Ken-Co kit fit into it? Or is the Ken-Co kit even needed with a 89017272 intake?
Ken-Co Industries Upper Plenum & Lower Intake Repair Kit
http://ken-co.com/manifold/default.htm
You can purchase the kit from Gagnon Auto and RV. They are a GMC dealer. The phone number is 1-800-498-3350. The price is $80 shipped in the US
I strongly feel that this is an essential upgrade for the 95+ Bonneville. This is the right way to prevent the problem from happening again. I don't think my car has the upper intake leak yet but since my lower intake is leaking I am going to have this installed at the same time. Plus I will feel confident that I won't need a new upper intake in 20,000 miles.
One note is that the upper sleeve from the Ken-Co kit for the upper intake does not seem to fit into the Dorman replacement intake being sold on Ebay and local parts stores. The Dorman hole seems to be a 1/8" too small for the Ken-Co kit. The lower intake manifold stove pipe in the kit should still work fine however and will be better than keeping the OEM stovepipe in place. I strongly feel that if you need a new intake you would be better off with a new GM upper manifold part #89017272 and then also install the Ken-Co kit or a new GM lower intake manifold with the new smaller diameter stove pipe and you won't need the Ken-Co kit.
The GM part# 89017272 upper manifold is $135 from GMpartsdirect.com
The GM part# 24508923 lower manifold is $167 from GMpartsdirect.com
The Ken-co Kit is $80 from Gagnon Auto
For those wondering, it seems that GM redesigned the lower intake in 2000 or 2001 with a new smaller diameter stove pipe. The part number for 1995-2004 has not changed but the replacement parts are rumored to have the smaller diameter stove pipe installed in them. To bad we don't know how to identify the changeover on the outside of the lower intake before it is all taken apart.
All this information I have provided is not from firsthand experience. I have simply been trying to piece together all the info i have been able to find from other peoples experience. The biggest question is what change was made to the new GM upper intake part# 89017272? Will the Ken-Co kit fit into it? Or is the Ken-Co kit even needed with a 89017272 intake?
03-16-2005, 10:17 AM
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Gmtorque, Excellent presentation !!
-you have me curious about the new UIM part number.
Also, at present, the only way I know to tell if you have the new LIM with the smaller EGR standpipe, is to actually peek inside to see if there is an air gap between the pipe and the plastic hole. And of course, that means either removing the throttle body, or possibly just the hose between the filter box and TB, and then carefully removing the honeycomb piece at the front of the TB, opening the throttle blade, and look inside with a flashlight.
If only we could find out at what date the changeover was made. -of course even with that, there is always some "fudge factor" involved.
Maybe someone will discover some simple rather obscure external difference on the LIM itself !!
-you have me curious about the new UIM part number.
Also, at present, the only way I know to tell if you have the new LIM with the smaller EGR standpipe, is to actually peek inside to see if there is an air gap between the pipe and the plastic hole. And of course, that means either removing the throttle body, or possibly just the hose between the filter box and TB, and then carefully removing the honeycomb piece at the front of the TB, opening the throttle blade, and look inside with a flashlight.
If only we could find out at what date the changeover was made. -of course even with that, there is always some "fudge factor" involved.
Maybe someone will discover some simple rather obscure external difference on the LIM itself !!
03-16-2005, 10:48 AM
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upper
You could install the Delphi improved upper (see sticky).
Its designed to withstand the higher temps. and they are readily available used.
I don't know of any Delphi failures on the board.
Its designed to withstand the higher temps. and they are readily available used.
I don't know of any Delphi failures on the board.
03-16-2005, 12:57 PM
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Maybe that new part # I listed above for the upper intake is the redesigned Delphi unit that was used in conjuction with the smaller EGR tube in the lower intake in 2000 or 2001 vehicles.
I would say that is very likely the case and that by not changing your old design egr tube to a new design smaller diameter you may still have a potential problem in rare situations.
Seems to me that you have three choices to fix the problem or potential problem.
1. If the upper intake is still good then just use the Ken-Co kit for both upper and lower manifolds. Metal sleeve for the upper and smaller diameter metal egr tube for lower. Cheapest
2. If the upper is damaged get a new or used Rochester or Delphi one that is not damaged. Then install the Ken-Co kit on both upper and lower. Metal sleeve for the upper and smaller diameter metal egr tube for lower. You could also buy a new upper from the dealer that should be the Delphi unit. Avg price
3. If the upper is damaged replace the upper and lower manifold with new parts from GM that have both been redesigned. The upper (new design Delphi) being more heat resitant and the lower using the smaller diameter EGR tube. Most expensive
I would say that is very likely the case and that by not changing your old design egr tube to a new design smaller diameter you may still have a potential problem in rare situations.
Seems to me that you have three choices to fix the problem or potential problem.
1. If the upper intake is still good then just use the Ken-Co kit for both upper and lower manifolds. Metal sleeve for the upper and smaller diameter metal egr tube for lower. Cheapest
2. If the upper is damaged get a new or used Rochester or Delphi one that is not damaged. Then install the Ken-Co kit on both upper and lower. Metal sleeve for the upper and smaller diameter metal egr tube for lower. You could also buy a new upper from the dealer that should be the Delphi unit. Avg price
3. If the upper is damaged replace the upper and lower manifold with new parts from GM that have both been redesigned. The upper (new design Delphi) being more heat resitant and the lower using the smaller diameter EGR tube. Most expensive
03-16-2005, 01:00 PM
#5
I think everyone'* starting to over analyze the UIM...
The thing to keep in mind is that fixing the upper is only half the problem. The other half is the lower intake gaskets. On my car, I changed the upper with a fresh GM one (Bob has the old one), and replaced the lower gaskets. The lower gaskets were JUNK after only 77,000 miles.
Coming up with a solution for the upper is great, however, we can't overlook what lurks below what the upper mounts to.
And in my opinion, I don't know if we'll ever come with a rock solid solution for GM engines that just eat through lower intake gaskets. 
The thing to keep in mind is that fixing the upper is only half the problem. The other half is the lower intake gaskets. On my car, I changed the upper with a fresh GM one (Bob has the old one), and replaced the lower gaskets. The lower gaskets were JUNK after only 77,000 miles.
Coming up with a solution for the upper is great, however, we can't overlook what lurks below what the upper mounts to.
And in my opinion, I don't know if we'll ever come with a rock solid solution for GM engines that just eat through lower intake gaskets.
03-16-2005, 01:05 PM
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Well The reason I am looking close at the upper intake situation is because my lower IS leaking and getting replaced this weekend. The upper intake seems fine on my car right now but I also want to prevent having the upper intake failure in the future. If I can solve the upper intake problems now I can save a good chunk of money in the future.
03-16-2005, 08:41 PM
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gmtorque, from my experience of doing both my '99 and the '02, I'd say that you are exactly on track. -do the whole deal. If the UIM is in good shape, then the sleeve is all you need for it. If you already have the smaller EGR tube, then you're done with the upper fix. Otherwise, install the smaller EGR tube. -either the Ken-Co kit, or make the parts yourself. AND IT IS EXACTLY RIGHT about the lower gaskets needing replaced. I have used both FelPro, and Victor. (-still have a new GM set hanging on a nail in the garage, and I suspect that is where they will stay.) They have those silly splits in all of the coolant ports, and until I can get someone to prove to me that is a good idea, I'll stick with those without the splits.
03-17-2005, 08:02 AM
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I am glad you posted that about the GM lower gaskets. I was just planning to use the GM ones but now I think I will go with a set of Felpro or Victor.
What about the UIM gaskets? The GM ones on my car seem fine so should I just use GM again?
What about the UIM gaskets? The GM ones on my car seem fine so should I just use GM again?
03-17-2005, 11:30 AM
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I used the typical "internet-order-online" replacement UIM on the '99, and it has worked out just fine. (it comes with all new gaskets/seals)
I TOTALLY RECOMMEND AGAINST using ANY Part, I don't care who makes it, and still allow the hot EGR tube to come in contact with the UIM. Come on guys, this ain't even any scientific mystery here,,,,, Put a hunk of plastic of the stove, and heat it up for a few years, and see what you get. -I don't care how "high tech" that we immagine the plastic may be,,,,,
It is totally simple: You have to get a barrier, preferably with some air space, between the hot part, and the plastic. The Ken-Co kit does a great job of doing both. And granted anyone with a slightly inventive mind can come up with their own mods that will also work just fine and dandy.
If your original UIM is not totally ruined, then the sleeve and epoxy will fix it.
And yes, I reused the all the original gaskets on the '02 UIM when I put it back together. Since they are red silicone beaded gaskets, they should essentially last forever.
AND, the '02 already had the smaller EGR tube, so I didn't have to mess with that part.
As for the LIM gaskets, that is a little different story. As I have stated before, the blue silicone GM units, with those four little splits in each coolant port look pretty questionable to me, when compared to the red silicone FelPro or Victor units without the splits. (afterall, that was the apparent point of failure on my '99 gaskets, so why wouldn't I expect that replacing them with the identical design part is only "resetting the time-to-failure clock" to last just about as long as the originals.)
Hey, I honestly don't know about the LIM gaskets, but that is certainly my opinion.
I TOTALLY RECOMMEND AGAINST using ANY Part, I don't care who makes it, and still allow the hot EGR tube to come in contact with the UIM. Come on guys, this ain't even any scientific mystery here,,,,, Put a hunk of plastic of the stove, and heat it up for a few years, and see what you get. -I don't care how "high tech" that we immagine the plastic may be,,,,,It is totally simple: You have to get a barrier, preferably with some air space, between the hot part, and the plastic. The Ken-Co kit does a great job of doing both. And granted anyone with a slightly inventive mind can come up with their own mods that will also work just fine and dandy.
If your original UIM is not totally ruined, then the sleeve and epoxy will fix it.
And yes, I reused the all the original gaskets on the '02 UIM when I put it back together. Since they are red silicone beaded gaskets, they should essentially last forever.
AND, the '02 already had the smaller EGR tube, so I didn't have to mess with that part.
As for the LIM gaskets, that is a little different story. As I have stated before, the blue silicone GM units, with those four little splits in each coolant port look pretty questionable to me, when compared to the red silicone FelPro or Victor units without the splits. (afterall, that was the apparent point of failure on my '99 gaskets, so why wouldn't I expect that replacing them with the identical design part is only "resetting the time-to-failure clock" to last just about as long as the originals.)
Hey, I honestly don't know about the LIM gaskets, but that is certainly my opinion.